How to Become 📸 the Celebrity CEO, with Ramon Ray

Welcome. To Amplify, the personal brand entrepreneur show. Today on the. Show, Bob is speaking. With Ramon Ray. If you're local and you don't want to be that content person just by showing up on a regular basis and be of service over six months, a year, take your pick of time, people will begin to know you and see you and identify. Me and Bob can sit in our little offices here behind with the cool lights and cameras, and we produce a ton of content. And we have our communities, fair enough. But to Bob's challenge to me, I want to repeat again, you're local, you're there, Ramon. I got 20 minutes this week. Hi there and welcome back to the Personal Brand Business Show. My name is Bob gentle and every week I speak to incredible people who share their secrets to building, marketing and monetizing their expertise, intentionally growing a unique personal brand and the mindset you need for your business to grow and thrive. If you're new to the show, then while you still have your device on your hand, take a second to hit the subscribe button and that way you won't miss a single thing. And if you are a regular listener, consider sharing the show with just one person. It's the very best way that you can help the show grow and help me reach more people. I f you are watching on YouTube, hi YouTube, YouTube is new, Ramon. Take a second to subscribe and also consider giving the video a thumbs up. So this week I have honestly been struggling how to introduce this week's guest, and I'll tell you this, he is the author of celebrity CEO, How entrepreneurs can thrive by building a community and a strong personal brand. I'll tell you this, I met Ramon Ray a year ago and it was a peculiar experience because we met in a hall, probably with a 1,000 people milling around. I don't know, have you ever played Sims on the computer back in the day? You can see there's lots of people walking around, bouncing into walls, and then occasionally there's a character walking around. It looks like it's being properly controlled. That little star thing that sits above the head is shining that much brighter. You stood out in this room and I thought, I need to get to know this guy. It has taken me literally nearly a year to get a conversation with you. I'm really looking forward. Ramon, welcome to the show, first of all. Thank you so much. It's good to be here, man. I f after a year, it's good to be here. And thank you for the value you provide to the community and your podcast and more. So thank you for having me. I'm excited to serve with you. Thank you. So for the listener or the viewer who's meeting you for the first time, can you maybe just tell us a little bit about who you are, where you are, and what you do, rather than me make a hand twisted mess of it? Sure. Because you have a lot of things going on. Absolutely, I do. Three things about me I think I'd love people to know is one, as I do have in my bio of recent, but only because of market demand, I'm unapologetically positive. Bob, I really love people. From the Uber driver to the airport. I love conversation. Just even saying, How are you today? I posted something on Facebook recently, a cleaning lady from the Caribbean. I said, How are you? She fired back, I'm doing great. I said, Why are you doing great? She said, Because I save 5 % of my energy for negative people. The other 95 % I keep. So that's one. I love people. Two, I have two adult children. We're married almost 30 years, 28 years or so. So I'm blessed to have a family that I love and who loves me. And then I went on triple newer. Last but not least, an entrepreneur, last but not least. An entrepreneur started five businesses, small companies, but it started five and sold three of them. Happy to have a exit. Authored five books. And I worked at the United Nations for some years, starting my side businesses. So I haven't always been the remote of today. I know what side hustle is like and grinding and getting a college degree, working a full time, having a family until I was fired. But that's what I am today, an entrepreneur who started several niche online publications and then a motivational speaker. That's a bit who I am. Like I said, you have a lot going on. And it's honestly a struggle to know where to start with you because there's so many places I want to go. But I guess where makes sense most is the post UN journey because I do a little bit of stocking before I have an interview. Sure. And try and get a sense of somebody's biography. You were at the UN and then suddenly that stopped. And what happened then? Tell me about that journey. Absolutely. So I started at the United Nations, Bob, right when I was metaphorically going into college out of high school, can't remember exactly, but about 20 something years old. Yeah, I was maybe a little younger, but that's what I recall, about 20, early 20, something like this. And one of the youngest UN hires, I think they start hiring people at 19, something like that. Just a low level role, I shouldn't say low level, but as an administrative support. That's what I was doing. Bottom line there for many, many years, rose up, became an administrative officer, working for a small office. And I had side businesses on the side. And at the UN, like any civil service quasi government federal take your pick job, there's rules, strong rules about having a side gig. I had permission to have that side gig, but then somebody got very jealous of me and they made a big stink about it. That permission was revoked. But I already had a taste of on triple Northship. I had the candy in my mouth. I already had this sucker sucking on it. And somebody, Bob or somebody wanted it, not you, but wanted to pull it out. I was like, so point being is that I was fired. My contract was not renewed and that thrust me into full time entrepreneurship. So at the time, I had a few gigs of clients doing webinars for them, as I recall, speaking, things of this nature. I had started smallbiztechnology. Com by then. That propelled me to full time entrepreneurship, saying, no, can't do it for free, can't do it for cheap. You need to pay me X amount. And from there, Bob, is the journey of Ramon. I think the main thrust of what I do is monetizing eyeballs content. Many people have it because it furthers their coaching, consulting. That's what many of our peers do in this industry. For me, most of it has been building a media company. So not getting money from the end user directly, if it's helpful, people understand more what I do, but building smallbiztechnology. Com, smart hustle. Com, small business summit, all of which I've sold and leveraging sponsorships to do it. So that thrusts me into that world of sponsorships, content. And then the other half, which I do today is motivational speaking. But back to the UN. Yes, started at the UN. Had a great time there until I had the conflict there, but eventually got fired. But I must say, Bob, I learned quite a bit. Just the international part helped me. You're in the elevator with people speaking English to Arabic to Spanish to Irish to take your pick. And somebody who may look like Bob or look like me, Ramon, those who don't see me as black American, they could be speaking fluent Japanese. You don't know. So that was a cool career. So the celebrity CEO book, what was the trigger for writing that? Because for me, it's such a powerful idea. I think it's something a lot of people shy away from. Most people when they build a business, it's because they're a great technologist or the technician, we'll say. They're great at doing a thing, but they don't necessarily crave visibility. In fact, for me, that level of visibility that I force myself into, although I'm not forcing myself anymore, but initially it hurt. It was like putting on a jacket full of crushed glass in. The beginning. I've never heard of that one. A jacket full of crushed glass. That's a new one. I literally just made it up. Most entrepreneurs, they became entrepreneurs because they were great technicians. They're not really craving visibility, but business success almost demands it. I think that's why a lot of people, they hit certain thresholds. I'm curious to know, what was your trigger for writing that book? And what was your personal brand journey like? So the trigger for writing it was because many people asked me, Ramon, how have you... As of today, it wasn't back then all these accolades, but how have you interviewed all five sharks on shark tank, the American TV show? How have you got to interview President Obama? Interviewed Ivanka Trump, interviewed, been in the United States Congress, been in several media publications, getting on many podcast. They see me, Ramon, you're building your personal brand in the US. We have something called score. Org free service to help hundreds of thousands of small business owners. For a month I was there, we had 4,000 people on a webinar. So the point I'm making, Bob, is that as you may have observed in your research, I've done that. I've been out there on South by Southwest social media marketing world, you name it, in this small business world, in my marketplace, this is what I teach and preach, right? Not everywhere, but in my world, Ramon shows up. If it has small business, over the years I've been there. So I found that that's helped my business. I don't do cold calling. I haven't had direct sales. A lot of mine are, quote unquote, inbound leads. And that's where I said, you know what? I think there's a book inside. It's not the thickest book in the world. But that's where I said I can share my principles of today that principles of getting attention, which building trust and then converting to sales. Maybe he could be our mutual friend, John Jansons, no like and trust and these things we've heard. But that was Ramon's version. So that was the catalyst of why I did it, Bob, because I wanted to share with people, listen, you're a guy and I feel myself crying every time I say this, but I don't spell well. I know I speak too fast. I'm not the most strategic guy in the world. I'm not the next Bob or Tony Robbins or Marie Forl eo. Take your pick of one of our favorite peers or stars, right? But yet I've done it. I've honed the craft. I think I've led the way and shown that if you're willing, and my encouragement, Bob, to your point of those who push back against it, I get it because I hear this a bit, I don't want to be a celebrity. But the context of celebrity for me not being the next Michael Jackson or take your pick of Who You Want to Be, but it's that Bob can be well known to large companies who want their midmarket staff to be more known. That's it. Ramon can be well known to the coaches, consultant, speakers who say, I'd love to increase my brand and stay one person. Seth Godin talks about bringing a freelancer, a small business owner. I want to stay a freelancer. Well, if you're going to be that, there's some things you could do to get more visibility, which will get you more sales. Perfect. I love that answer. Following up on that, a question that I often ask guests, and you touched on this, is opportunity can come to us through one of four routes. It can come through inbound, as you mentioned. It can come through outbound sales activity, going after what you want. It can come through ads or it can come through content. I'm curious to know what that mix looks like for you in reality. You mentioned that there's a lot of inbound, but given the visibility of your personal brand, I'm wondering if you're an outlier in terms of the rest of that. No, great question. I think the mix of it is, and I like how you frame that, that's a whole podcast in itself or a book for you, Bob, but is nd rifting off what you said is I do so much content. So that's what I meant by it's inbound because of that. So that's why that's helpful. So I do so much content and it's not perfect, Bob. It's not fair to say there's no rhyme or reason, but sometimes I wish it was a bit more purposeful using the perfect YouTube thumbnails or whatever. That's just not me. But I do so much scattering, so much... Vomiting is a negative word, but in this case, a positive word. One thing people say all the time to me, Bob, is Ramon, I see you everywhere. You and I, Bob, know that's not true. I'm not everywhere. I don't have the footprint of, Take your any famous person of the day. But for them, it appears that because there's Ramon doing an IG story in the morning saying, Good morning. God bless you. Have a great day. Encouraging people. There's Ramon at an event that's not his own, behind the scenes videotaping Bob's event. Ramon's not even speaking. And Ramon's then shooting video, putting on a Ramon's LinkedIn and tagging Bob. And Bob's like, Thanks, I'll share it out. So doing a lot of that thought leadership, Hey, randomly, let me do a LinkedIn live today. Doing that over and over and over, that's part of that celebrity CEO framework of you become known. People begin to see you. And then the brands I work with, the large corporate brands who pay me to host events, be on their stages, they're watching. And many, as you said, Bob, they don't want to be the celebrity CEO, but they're watching me and you. They're lurking. They're like that mid level manager at the bank. I've seen Ramon for the 18th time this month. Let's hire him to fly him out to South Dakota and speak. I hope that's helpful. It absolutely is. I think content is the silent ambassador. It's how we can actually scale our visibility in a way that you just can't do one on one. For me, I used to go to a lot of networking events, and I got my list of the routes opportunity can reach you wrong, and you pointed that out in the nice way. It isn't the four I gave. It's outbound sales, ads, relationships and networking and inbound. And you're right, the two that I gave should be combined into one, really. The way that you paint a picture of constant, consistent visibility, it's a really powerful thing. And I think a lot of people overestimate perhaps how much it takes or how complex that it needs to be. It's simply your image positively expressed on a regular basis will cut through. That is powerful. Your image positively expressed on a regular basis. I'm writing notes from you, Bob. I'm going to feedback your own. And one thing I wanted to mention as well is that, mother, I'd love your input on this or thought. There's those who may do it a bit more polished, a consistent podcast every X. Maybe you could do that. The video is perfect. The image is and that's the way to do it. I think my methodology of I wish I was more consistent. I wish it was more polished, indeed. I wish it was more off brand, but it works for me because I throw out so much in so different ways. It's like having a gun or a buckshot, whatever example you want to use in the middle of the scattering, you throw the thing around and hit it. You're going to hit people. So I'm not saying it's perfect, but in my hokey way... Yeah, Ramon, do you have a podcast? Yeah, I stopped it after a few hundred episodes or whatever. Ramon, do you do video? Yeah, but so much of that my audience knows me. The thing is, the way I look at content is there are three different streams. There's the short term investment. I like an investment portfolio analogy. So we have short term investments and they're all talking ads, paid content. Then we have medium term investments, social media, social content, social networking, and they can be great. They can work really well. You play this masterfully. This is where you're constantly visible. Then there's the long term investments, YouTube, podcast, blog. Those are the things that pay compound interest over time. If you stop doing them today, they'll continue working for you for the rest of their existence. Your podcast, you may be stopped, I bet you still gets lots of downloads. Same with YouTube content. Social content is not like that, but what it does have is intimacy and immedi. And you have all three strands locked in when you have a promotion, the ads are there working for you. And I think this is where a lot of people struggle is they just hit one of those three strands, and then they wonder why it's hard. If you play, especially the last two strands, you have that great content from a podcast or YouTube, bring that back to social media. Now you stand out. Plus there's all the experience and the confidence and the network that you built through the long term content coming back to support you in that. And again, that's where I guess I want to go next is community because your book isn't just about building a personal brand. It's about building a community around your personal brand. And given your book is aimed at traditional entrepreneurs, I'm curious about your perspective on what that community can look like for an ordinary business, not necessarily a content business, but your average business owner in the street who wants to build his business, his personal brand. How can they bring community to bear in that? I live in the New York area, as you know, Bob, and one example of that, and it's metaphorically, but I do see it played out. Let's take, as you said, the main street business owner who's an accountant, a lawyer, my friend Ryan who owns a bakery, website designer, any business that's you and I cheat because we produce tons of content, right? But to your point, the one who's like, Ramon, I'm in a cub, I'm in a mechanic. So here's how you can build that community. I see this happen in Manhattan Chamber, where I'm at it quite a bit in other organizations. If you're local and you don't want to be that content person just by showing up on a regular basis and be of service over six months, a year, take your pick of time, people will begin to know you and see you and identify. Me and Bob can sit in our little offices here behind with the cool lights and cameras, and we produce a ton of content, and we have our communities. Fair enough. But to Bob's challenge to me, I want to repeat again, you're local, you're there, Ramon, I got 20 minutes this week. That's all I can do. Ramon, I can take three days and go to a networking event because I just had a baby and I'm a local business. I'm not going to produce all that content. You do that, localize in a local market, and then add a touch to what Bob said. Do your selfies, do a little bit of LinkedIn, and you start to do that, guess what? And using New York City as an example, but this works in Australia, it works in India, any local city, people connect locally. So you start to, over the course of a year, the local chamber president that you took a selfie with and she shares her picture out, that's a connection. That's building community around your own name or business. That means when you go to the next event and it's with the local bank lenders there. And you took that selfie, did a little comment from them, it's there. So I hope that made a little bit of sense. But even for the local person who says remote, I don't want to do a daily podcast. Great. Where you're at in your community, just be 10 % purpose full, network, be of service, take a few selfies, and get on panel discussions. Maybe bring your child or hire a local person or ask her. Here's another thing, Bob. The person in the third row, because the front row is too close, give them your phone as I've done before. Say, listen, do me a favor, I'm going to be on this panel. Not main stage speaker. Me and Bob may do that. You just got on the panel for two minutes. Could you take my phone and record me when they call me up and say, Alexander, take that. Now that's more content for LinkedIn. So what do you think, Bob? Is that an example of don't be a content producer, just do what you can? I think it's a really great example. I'm curious to know your perspective on the minimum effective dose. And you touched on this a little bit, but people say they see you everywhere they go. People say they see me everywhere they go. I am not on my game all the time. I go through phases. My content creation goes in and out like the tide, but the tide just keeps going. But I know that the impression is that I'm always on. I'm curious to know your perspective on the minimum effective dose for if you want somebody to get that impression that you're always there. I think that's great. And I think that for me, it's not done intentionally, but I would say the minimum effective dose, one, there's two things. And I love this. You and I are brainstorming, masterminding with each other, Bob, but people are going to listen in on it. I just love it. That's my whole show. I love this. This is causing me to think more than I've done. But here's what I think, Bob, it could be the aspect of two things. One is intensity or frequency. That's the game ish I play, always posting I G lives, all this. The other one is more so substantive. So here's what I'm trying to say. If you're not going to post a lot, waking up every day, every day, every day, content producer, maybe like me or Bob or metaphorically, we're doing. When you're doing it, make it impactful. Hence, that's why I say you better be dialed in. Take that selfie, post it on LinkedIn with a substantive comment. Maybe you don't do anything else that day. Three days later, you're going to the next local event and you're videotaping somebody else speaking, you post that on LinkedIn and you're doing a substantive post. That's going to take a bit longer because it's not as frequent, but that will pay dividends. That's how I see it. But I'd love it. And I'd mentioned LinkedIn a few times because I think for business, I do think LinkedIn by far has a cashet there, but definitely, IG can work. I just don't like IG, Bob, talking about tactical because I think as of today, it still doesn't have links you can click. That's just one big... Besides doing stories and IG and fancy stuff, ads, but Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, at least when you put a link in there, people can click it and things, but it's a small thing. But Bob, going back to your original question, that's my thinking of, yes, minimum. I love that, minimum effect. Yeah, if you're not going to do every day and a lot and several times and do the Gary Vee thing and have somebody following you, at least be very strategic and purposeful. And maybe, Bob, even though this may even make it ask, when you do that post, let's say Bob's like me and you know Bob's like me now and the example of I'm not posting every day. Hey, Bob, listen, you're calling me. I just posted on LinkedIn. Bob, could you comment and share it? Maybe you do that, too. I don't do that. But those who are doing it less frequent, dial it in a little more purposeful. I agree. I think bringing in some supporters to help you get some extra reach is a very valuable thing. It can come across as a bit scammy, spammy, disingenuous sometimes, but there's a time and a place for everything. One thing that I find a lot, and you must experience this as well when you're working with clients, is you've mentioned the selfie now probably a couple of dozen times, and that's not by accident. I'm trying to think of an analogy for this, but you tell people, Hey, you know what? I want you to take a selfie and post it on social media. It's almost like you're trying to squeeze a bubble in something, and every time you squeeze, it goes off somewhere else. They will find anything to do sometimes rather than take a selfie. In my perspective, and I've never really spoken to a neurologist or anything about this, but the selfie is doing something to the wiring of the brain and the recipient. There's a very good reason why the selfie works better than anything else. And I'm curious on your perspective on the selfie over some other form of graphic, even the super fancy graphics, why do you think the selfies work best? And what advice would you maybe have for people getting over their reluctance to step over that pain threshold and just suck it up? Sure. I love it. That's deep. And let me edit when I said the word selfie. My reference in that case, even though you know I'm the king of selfies, I take tons of pictures of myself, but I met with others as well. That's what I meant by selfie. Just to be clear to the audience, so Bob and I did this. You'll see this when you listen to this. Maybe you've seen it already. But I'm a firm believer, especially at an event I'm at. Hey, Bob, could we come over here, Bob? Let's just take a picture together. So I mean, selfie like that type, sharing it because then it's including Bob in. He sees it and that people generally give. So that's one. But you're right, the solo selfie, many people many ladies oftentimes at all. I'm just saying many who I work with and see, they don't like it. But the thing about it, it's a selfie with someone else. I think I've reached that or proven that already. That's two of us together. We're building each other's networks. That's one. Then the solo selfie. I do solo selfies, Bob, in conjunction with the context to Matt. So not a boring selfie like just here's my new hand bag or look at my hairdo. I do that too, maybe. But it's more, hey, I'm at the local event or join me in Bob, look behind me. There's all these business owners there. Wow, this is great. That selfie ish video in the context where you are, bringing others in, maybe they're behind the scenes. So that's the selfie that I do, Bob, and it works. And third, let's not forget, as I said earlier, but I'll just repeat it, taking pictures of others. Bob's on stage speaking. I know he's there and maybe it's not his event, but do you know how many people have appreciated? I was at a Lamar Tyler traffic sales and profit, big event with a 1,000 entrepreneurs in Atlanta. An architect next to me got up on the mic to ask a question. I immediately took my phone. I took the whole video, him on mic for three minutes. He appreciated because unlike you and I, he's not a creator. So he may have never had a video of him in front of a thousand people. I wasn't in it at all, Bob. I just dropped boxes to him and said, Here's the video of you with a mic in hand asking a smart question. So I hope that didn't mix up your question too much, but those are some things I do. What I love about that is a lot of the time when I ask entrepreneurs, go back to what I said earlier about how opportunity finds them. Yes, they do ads. Yes, they do content. But the opportunities that move the dial for people, it's almost always relationships. And with that gesture, I don't mean to play people, but you're priming them for reciprocation. Unintentionally, even. You're right. Because I didn't do it with thought, but that's what happens. Bob, sorry, go ahead. But that's what happens. It's what goes around, and you're focusing on... You'll do the pushing, and what comes around will take care of itself. And that. I'm not going to call it tactical generosity, but it's making generosity part of your mission without worrying about what's going to come back, it can't help but be a strong strategy. And, Bob, you're unpacking what I didn't really know. Even as I'm sharing this, I'm helping others. This is not about me but helping others. What a superpower I have, Bob. I didn't realize it quite like that. But I think because I love content so much that unapologically, I just love content like, oh, it's another excuse for me to boost up my LinkedIn. I was at an event yesterday with a bank, big bank, global bank here in the US. I wasn't on stage, had no speaking role. I was just there cheering a graduation they had for their own Triple Nours. I put together, just now, a little hint, using an app called Modesto, which Vimeo bought, if that's helpful, just as we're helping people here. So that's a cool app I use. Good. Yeah, you know it. So that app I used, I strung together, just now I posted on LinkedIn, about a two to three minute video of the graduation because I know their corporate team, my guess, is not going to do quite like that with music and subtitles. They're not us, creators. So to your point, Bob, where to go? I don't know. But I instinctively did it because it's content for me selfishly. I wanted content on my LinkedIn, but I pushed and giving it to them. I'm going to be tagging them all their executives. Bob, in six months, three months, is there any surprise if Ramon's speaking, if Ramon's consulting, if Ramon's called in to host a major event? Of course not. I didn't do it that purposely, but thank you for bringing out to help others. This is why Bob and I are successful. We just give naturally and amplify and that goes around. What you said is so important. We push and boom, it goes right back around. I love that, Bob. Something I'm curious about, you come across as being very confident, very comfortable in your extraversion. Was it always the case? Yes. I'll give a context, though, because to give people hope and help. Where I'm not confident, and thank you, I'll take that complimenting question, but where I'm not confident, I must say is strategy. I've built several companies that have generated, and this is not directly what you asked, but I just want to share the vulnerable side of Ramon. I built several companies and I can generate several hundred thousand low one or two million in revenue that I can do, etc. No problem. But I must say, Bob, I'm thinking as I'm 50 years old this year, what's next? It makes me nervous when I see other peers of mine, I'll mention a name. Maybe people know the name Phil Jones, his book, Exactly What to Say. He's built a certification, all these things. I'm like, dang, how did he do that? So that's where I feel a bit stuck sometimes. But then I'm blessed at what I do. So yes, for me, I always have been as I am. I think that's how God made me a loud mouthed act first. May I give a small story, Bob? Is there time? Yeah, go for it. Small stories. This is different example, but my church was having a play and many, many years ago and some gang members rushed the stage. They had bandanas and bats on. I jumped up, decked one of the guys in the dead in the throat. He dropped down. My pastor jumps up and says, Ramon, it's a play. I didn't know it was a play, Bob. That's metaphorically, that's been Ramon for a while. I'm just a loudmouth a ck first jump in, butt in, then realize, Oh, I wish I wouldn't have said that. Oh, I wish I wouldn't have done that. Not a lie. But if it's helpful. So yes, Ramon's always been extraverted. Two, it's worked in my favor. Often, three, sometimes I wish I would have slowed down a bit. But then four, my lack is probably being a bit more consistent or purposeful or strategic, if that's helpful. For me, I'm almost your polar opposite, I'll be perfectly honest. I find most personal visibility extremely comfortable. I'm very comfortable with where I am now, and I constantly test my comfort zone and expand it. But it hasn't been an easy journey for me at all. But one of the things that I've found is that you worry about failure an awful lot. You alluded to this, that sometimes things just go wrong, but sometimes that just has to be okay. If you spend all your time worrying about what's going to go wrong with personal visibility, you may as well pack up, go home, just get a job for somebody else and be content with that. But the reality is, and we've alluded to this a few times, fortune favors the bold. This is a truth and it takes far less than you would think. One thing that I found is for every failure, there'll be a dozen successes, and there are more people cheering you on than you might think. One thing I'm curious on your perspective on is negativity, negative reactions, because you must get some negative reactions. Probably most of those negative reactions never reach you. But what's your perspective on when things go wrong, the negativity that when you're scaling your visibility is inevitable. How do you handle that? Yeah, and I answer it two ways, Bob, two different ways because I'm hearing two different questions from me. One is that when something tactically goes wrong during a live interview with me and Bob, we have 10,000 people, the servers crash. Bob. There's nothing I can do. I get over it very quickly. Not that I don't care wrong word to use, but I'm going to use that word. Just don't care. Sorry. I got to refund all their money. Oprah Winfrey is going to have to wait. It is what it is. What can we do? We did our best. Or our admin, or we screwed up, didn't do the right server connection. Therefore, the authentication token didn't work and it failed. Okay, listen, Megan or Genny or Steven, dude, listen, don't do this again. We just now lost a million dollars. It is what it is. That I get over quickly. But the second thing about rejection or whatever, maybe, but I love your insight because you're like my mind guy here. Maybe since I am super positive, Bob, and I'm cheery and happy, it just takes one minute. I could feel it already. It just takes Bob, and I know, Bob, you wouldn't speak this way to me, but pretend Bob to say, Ramon, you were speaking so fast, man, I can't use our podcast. You're an idiot. That will rip me apart and grab me. Everybody else said it was great. But Jenny in Row 3 came up and said, Ramon, you could wear a red shirt? Really? I'll have to work because I know that I know what I should do, but I have to work hard to get over that. So I hope that's helpful. So failure, that's tactical, computer, whatever, or I lost money, who cares? Move on. But it's the human thing. Somebody's speaking into my ear, even though I know I shouldn't, that will drag on me for a bit. Yeah, I think the technical stuff, you're right. There is nothing we can do about that. The problem with the personal stuff is there's always something we can do about it. But what you described there was the classic negativity bias. We will always pay attention to the negative and ignore the positivity bias entirely. For me, and I think this is something that you lean into brilliantly, if you look at this force of attraction, this is essentially what a personal brand is for. It's a giant brand magnet. We want to draw people into us. If you look at basic physics, a magnet has two poles, attraction and the repulsion. And if you want this strong force of attraction, you have to celebrate the attraction and the repulsion. You can't have one without the other. And I think for me, that was really liberating is understanding that that polarising effect, the more you show up as authentically yourself, the more you're going to attract people that are aligned with that. But at the same time, you're going to actively push away those who aren't. And that just has to be okay. In fact, you have to be great with it, not just okay with it. And I think that's why, yeah, if somebody doesn't like a red shirt, fantastic. The fact is, people were laughing, they were looking happy. But it does drag me down a bit like you asked about it. So that's the technical thing I get over. But that's where I have to not struggle too much. By God's grace, I'm 50 years old, a little mature, but that's the partner for moan. Maybe since I am so, other people may get over faster. Maybe you, but me, no. It's like, Okay, she said my glasses were dumb. Okay, let me promote. You've been in business over 20 years. Buckle up, Ramon. But it's hard sometimes. It always is hard. I think this is what I think people need to understand is it is hard, but the rewards are there. I mean, a bit of a thought experiment, what would your business look like now if you hadn't done it? Maybe it's so abstract to the point where it's not even helpful to talk about. But I look at my business, pre personal brand and post personal brand, they're completely different. Previously, my business was entirely local. Now my business is completely international. I'm working in my zone of genius most of the time. Most people never get the luxury of working in their zone of genius because they're so stuck in a local geographic area and they have to do anything for everyone. Yes. And I will give a shameless plug. I bought the domain zoneof genius. Com. There's some content there. I don't know what I'm going to do with it, but if people want to check out zoneof genius. Com, you can. I'm very intrigued by that. We'll see what happens. I just bought the domain and I said, let's see what happens, but let's get back on track. So one of the other things that I noticed in your LinkedIn bio that I want to ask about, because I'm really curious, is this whole idea of entrepreneur and residence. You've had that going on a few times. What even is that? I'm really interested. In the case of no BS, what it is is that there's large companies or other companies who want some cache and they like a person like Ramon or a Bob and others. And they're like, you know what? Let's put a flag in the ground and more so proclaim that we are a company for entrepreneurs. And they look to align themselves with other influencers. And that's a title that we often ask for and they're willing to give. So they can say that, hey, at Oracle or NetSuite, we have an entrepreneur residence. It sounds pretty freaking cool. And we do help them reach entrepreneurs, but that's what that is. I'm sure it came, I was told from a French word, or something. I forgot the word, whatever it is, a painter or something like that. But point is that that's what it is. Somebody who's adding value to a company and helping them spearhead, guide, be a torchlight to reach other business owners. It is a very cool idea. Thank you. I think it's an idea I'd like to play with a little bit. Please, you should. But I think when I meet somebody like you, it's an important thing and it's important for the listener. I'm not going to ask you what your revenue looks like, but I'm curious to know, because you have so many different things going on, how does it break down in terms of speaking, hosting, entrepreneurial activities, that thing. I can cheer for you. I'm glad. I think it'd be helpful for people. So for me, and again, just to be clear, everybody, full disclosure, my journey is not going to be your journey. Bob's journey is not my journey. My journey is at Bob's. So be clear that you can't... As I quote him quite a bit, I love his vibe. You can't copy me, but this will be helpful. My speaking fees, if that's helpful, is one data point about 20,000 or so that I can be compensated by a large corporate brand. That's what my speaking fee is. Depending on the year, depending on what it is, a lot of my revenue is, at least I tag it in my financial software, speaking because a lot of the social media blogging and things I do that often feeds into that. So a large part of my revenue is remote on stage speaking webinars, master classes where it's not. I don't have clients. I didn't have clients. So it's where the large brand is paying me. That's the bulk of what I do. Now, last year, for example, I built a media company, had quite a bit of traffic, had some sponsorships, but I sold it to another large corporate brand. So that to next, as it were, a lot of my revenue, I sold it for some good money, some good six figures. So I sold it for some good money for me. So I hope that's helpful. So a third or half it could be of revenues. Ramon out there speaking in some way. Another part of it is the sponsorship deals that I get, which are content based. I can work with my team in some way. And then what takes that hole off the chain is when I make an exit. So I buy domains, put content there, work with an SEO team, work with friends like Bob or whatever value we can co add together. And then the traffic comes and or I've done it three times. I'm sure I can do it four or five times more, and we sell that asset. That makes a lot of sense. I think for me, that is really useful to hear. Entirely selfishly, whenever I do meet somebody where the bulk of their income is speaking or that area, I work with a lot of people and I put my hand up to this. I do zero speaking. I never have. If you were speaking to me, for example, how would you encourage people to just make a start with that? Absolutely. I think there's two things, and by the way, I'm glad you said it because I talk about this with my son as well. We, as you and I metaphorically, those of you in the industry, look at each other for help, a little bit of jealousy and whatever, because I'm the same. I look at my son or you and I are getting to know each other. Oh, my God. I wish I had clients. And then Bob looking at me, Oh, my God. I wish I had corporate sponsors. We're not making about the same money. Meaning, just everybody listening, for us regular people, nobody hears Tony Robbins and all that. How you make your $500,000, $200,000 a million, it's about the same. The guy who has high end coaching, he wishes he had FedEx or Verizon as a sponsor, as I do. Me who has a sponsor, I'm looking at him like, dang, I wish I had a high end coaching service. So that's that. And then for getting into speaking, a few things I would say. I think one, understand what type of speaking you want to do. I think that's one thing that's really important. I'm going to assume that everybody has the intellectual knowledge of it. If that's a given, I'm going to assume. And the reason I say what type of speaking, because my speaking, Bob, in fairness, it's very high energy, very entertaining. When I'm asked to speak, rarely do people care what I speak about. They care, but they already know it's going to be marketing or something like this. But I did a corporate gig last week for a company on change. I'm not the guy of change. I'm not a corporate speaker. But what they want is some Ramon Mojo, that excitement and fun and engagement. Yes, what I say is important and makes sense, but they want that. So that's what I'm an entertainment type of main stage keynote. Everybody stand up. I can't hear you. That's me. Now, you, Bob, or other friends of mine, they could be, You know what? Listen, I can grow into that a bit. But that's not me. As Bob has said, a little more introvert, a little more quieter. But you could still give a great keynote speech. Kind of like a Phil Jones, doesn't worry. Others like that who may have a different demeanor and drop science. Five things that are coming your way that you need to know for your brand. My name is Bob gentle. Let's begin. There's no fire. You're not yelling. Nobody's jumping up and screaming, and it can still be just as effective. So that's why deciding a positioning, Hey, don't put me first. If you're looking for somebody to get people screaming out of their seats, not your guy. But you want to put me in 11 o'clock or whatever it is, 3 o'clock to drop some 90 minutes signs of their scribbling notes where they're like thinking at the end of it, they're like, Wow, I'm your guy. If that's playing with you here, if that's helpful to help people. Yeah, it makes perfect sense. Yeah. And last thing I'll add is that I do think every speaker, Bob, you have to be engaging. That is a must. I'm not saying entertaining, not saying loud, not saying funny. You got to be engaging in some way and then to be very uninform. So I just always like to add that because I think a speaker that's just, Hi, I'm Ramon, here's stats on the future of the economy. That's not good. But you don't have to speak that way to be engaging. You can put a smile. Everybody, listen, I want you to raise your right hand. If you feel X, Y, Z, X, Y, Z, raise your left hand. A, B, C, A, B, C. Okay, great. Now, Bob could do that. Meaning that's not who Ron's screaming, but there's got to be something. I want you to take a look at this slide versus that slide. Do you see how the human brain connects? All day long. That's very engaging. But it's not trying to be what Ramon is. That's how God made me loud and screaming. That's just my style. So Ramon, I'm looking at the time and we should probably bring things to a close fairly soon. But I'm curious because there may be people listening thinking, Ramon, he's my guy. I need some Ramon in my business. What does an ideal client look like for you? Sure. Two or three things. One, if there's people listening and you're like, you know what? We'd love to have Ramon on our stage, bring some of that Ramon to our event anywhere in the world to host your large corporate event and or share principles of marketing. And me and Bob will come and join together and do it. Definitely. I'd love you to find me at ramon ray. Com, Ramon Ray. Com. Ramon Ray. Com, find me. I'd love to see how I can serve you. And then second, Bob, those who want to be the celebrity CEO of their industry, those who want to be more known, feel free to check me out at celebrityceo. Com. We have blueprints and workshops. I do things of that. But thank you, Bob. It's been great being with you. Well, I was going to say, if people want to connect with you, how would you like them to do that? You mentioned where they can do that. But I was on your website earlier and I downloaded your CEO blueprint, which is pretty awesome. I don't very often print these things, but I have it sitting on the printer every day is a school day. And I'm never happier than when I'm learning from fellow professionals. Sure. I'm looking forward to studying that later today. Now, this has been awesome. I've really had the best time. I can already tell I'm going to need to have you back again. Because today, I think it's the nature of your business. I'm going to be all over the place with you. I apologise, I'm not sorry to the listener or the viewer. That's right. That's just how it was going to be today. I really hope people got lots from it. Next time we have you on, we can maybe be a little bit more strategic. But Ramon, thank you so much for your time. Thank you. Thank you, Bob, for having me. It's been great. That brings us to the end of another episode. Thanks to you for listening. If you enjoyed the show, then I would gently encourage you to leave a five star review, that's five, like the fingers on your hand are the weeks of the working week, days of the working week, but literally five, not two or one or anything. And if you did enjoy it, then consider sharing the show with just one person. If you did enjoy this show and you will also love the Personal Brand Business roadmap, it's 100 % free as a gift from me. It's nearly 50 pages of everything you will need to start scale or just fix your expert business. You can click or tap the link in the show notes or the video description or visit amplifyme.agency roadmap. Ramon, thank you so much for your time today. You home for listening. Thank you very much and see you next week.