If you want to receive great value then you need to be a valuable person. Spending a little time each day trying to smooth out life's path for someone else, whether through connecting or any other way will compound up over time and return value back to you tenfold.
Today's podcast guest is Pablo Gonzalez. Pablo's whole world view and business philosophy can be easily summed by the Zig Zigler quote - 'You can have everything in life that you want - if you just help enough other people get what they want'.
Pablo Gonzalez is the inventor of the Relationship Flywheel, host of the Hief Executive Connector podcast and Not Your Average Investor Show, and Co-Founder of BeTheStage.live- a marketing clients that turns clients into community and community into record breaking profits.
He’s obsessed with human connection, and he’s used his expertise to manage a 120 person, $15M construction business at 25, build various young professional groups for charities, and be named a Latino Leader of the Future by Latino Leaders Magazine and a Top 20 Under 40 for Brickell Magazine in Miami.
Pablo's website : https://connectwithpablo.com/
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If you want to attract great value, then you need to be a valuable person, spending a little time each day trying to smooth out life's path for someone else, whether through connecting or some other way, will compound up over time and return value back to you tenfold. Today's guest is Pablo Gonzalez. Pablo's whole world view and business philosophy can easily be summed up by the Zig Ziegler quote You can have anything you want in life if you just help another people get what they want.
Before I jump into the interview, I want to share a couple of things. The first one is that the podcast has had a small name change. It was the digital marketing entrepreneurship, which never really quite sat right with me because the podcasts never really been about that. It's now the personal brand entrepreneurship. And I think that's really what's at the heart of the show. Ordinary people playing bigger. Now, it's not a big deal for anybody, but it's a big deal for me.
I'm really pleased with the name change. It really makes everything much clearer for me about what this podcast about hope you will agree that ordinary people playing bigger is a great thing. Secondly, I want to start bringing in some audience participation. I want to bring you into the show. I want your questions and your comments. So if you head over to any of the podcast pages on my website, or you can just hit the questions link in the show notes, you can go to my website and record a question for me right there on the page.
So simple. If you do, I will maybe play your question on the show and the guests and I will start discussing some of them. I love this idea and I would be thrilled if you recorded something for me, but keep it clean. Well, you don't have to keep it clean, but it makes it easy for me. It's one less click. I don't have to click the explicit box. So hi there. And welcome back to Amplify the personal brand entrepreneur show.
I'm Bob Gentle and every week I'm joined by amazing people who share what makes their business work. If you're new to the show, take a second right now to subscribe. That way you won't miss new episodes and you can grab some older ones when you're done with this one. Don't forget as well, you can join my Facebook community, just visit, amplify me forward, slash insiders, and you'll be taken right there. Now, we all know how hard it is to juggle all the things in your business accounts, meetings, a never ending inbox.
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It's such a time saver. So welcome along and let's meet people. So this week I'm really excited to welcome Pablo Gonzalez to the show. Pablo is like the alter ego of pop, which he'll be discovered quite soon. So, Pablo, for people who don't know you, why don't you tell us a little bit about who you are, where you are? I'm already jealous and what you do next, Bob.
I love this. I love that we identified that we are each other's alter ego, yet we completely are down the same vein, just opposite sides of the coin.
And I think it's wonderful. Man Bob, I'm in I'm in Florida.
Right? I know that. I know that it's your favourite place. I'm in Jacksonville, Florida. That's the northeast part. Like, right before you get to Georgia. I grew up in Miami. I'm a typical Miamian. And what is it? What do I do, Bob? I'm I'm obsessed with human relationships.
And right now, I believe that we have the ability to have more relationships than we've ever had before.
And by that, I mean, you've probably wished somebody a happy birthday that you haven't seen in twenty years in the last couple of weeks. And that has never been an option. And it's because of these digital mediums that we have to create relationships, and I think the world has really gotten used to that idea from a personal standpoint, but business hasn't caught up. I think our culture on a personal level is digital and our business culture is still lagging behind.
And it's old school. And I fundamentally believe that most businesses are relationship businesses.
So if you're not thinking about this as a way to growth, how you scale your relationships based on these new digital mediums, then you're simply being inefficient or ineffective in the vision that you were painting for your business's future. So if you were to ask me what I do, I'm in marketing, right?
Like I design and execute content creation plans that allow businesses to scale their relationships and lead to business growth.
But I really am obsessed with this idea of scaling relationships and and moving towards this future where we are rapidly automating.
Right. Like we are rapidly becoming this like society where I can tell you how much I love your glasses. And in 45 minutes, there's going to be a Facebook ad that is selling me glasses that look like what you're wearing. That's only going to get that's only going to get bigger. Right. Like that's only going to get better or worse.
However, you however you want to see that. And the only way that you were going to solve for Chern that you're going to keep clients engaged with you, keep your employees inside of your company, that you're going to keep people in your circle when they're going to have unlimited options for whatever they want and they're going to be offered to them immediately. The moment that they care about it is by leaning into relationships and creating a community around you, because you can switch products, you can switch service providers, but, you know, you don't switch friends as easily.
I think what's really interesting, listening to you and there's a couple of places I could go with that is different businesses discover opportunity in different ways. And a lot of the people I speak to, in fact, I'll rewind a little bit opportunity can come to us through one of four main paths. It comes as a result of our advertising activities. No matter how you do it, people see your ads, they go. That looks kind of cool. He looks kind of cool.
She looks kind of cool. I'm going to I'm going to connect there. Or they can come because they've discovered some of your content somewhere. Or they can come because you jumped out in front of them, said, this is who I am. This is what I do, outbound sales activity. Or they can come through referrals from your network. And what's often surprised me, because this is the digital marketing entrepreneurs who I speak to, a lot of people who run their businesses predominantly online.
So consultants, coaches, people like that, people that you would think the majority of their business comes through ads or content creation when actually a lot of their real opportunity comes through relationships. And I guess where I'm going with this is what I found across the board is most businesses, they have a mix of those four, but a lot of those, they have systems for their systems, for their active systems, for content creation, their systems for outbound sales activity.
But they don't have systems for relationships. And what you said about most businesses are still looking at this in a very old school way is a lot of the time because the systems available still look at it in an old school way. And what I mean by that is CRM systems. Most CRM systems look at people as data points and opportunities rather than relationships. And I remember looking back and this is a very long winded bit of content from me, I don't talk that much on the podcast, but most of my business used to come through referrals.
Still does, kind of. And you take the average person we know, people like you and I, business acquaintances, we probably have a couple of thousand. The average person in the average business, probably 800. How do you keep track of 800 relationships in a meaningful way if you don't have a system? So I'm keen on your reflection on that. From a systems perspective, how do you maintain and nurture relationships across that diverse I contact base?
Yeah, Bob, I think you're I think you're dead on, man. So everything that I've learnt, you know what I said, marketing and marketer last. Right? Because I've just recently started just accepting the fact that I'm in marketing these days. Everything that I've learnt and everything that I'm executing on comes from lessons learnt in creating volunteer groups for non-profit organisations and the lessons that I learnt in doing that. Is the fact that the most influential people in society, the most connected people in society are the people that serve on these non-profit boards, and they got there by being of service to other people, right?
By by being that person that takes a meeting understands what you're about, what your superpowers, they ask great questions. They listen, and then they go and say, who can I introduce you to that can enable you in your mission, in your journey? How can I add value to your life?
And that, Bob, you know, we talked about it right before the podcast, right, like I am an extreme extrovert, but you notice that I'm an extrovert that listens. That was a completely learnt behaviour for me. Right? I learnt that in my early 30s when I started getting into these groups of people and started realising that the way that you build relationships is isn't my up until I turned 30, my Ace Ventura shtick and being the funny guy in the room, it's how I can be the most valuable person in the room.
So so then I started looking around and thinking, what are the systems that these people, first of all, very, very easy to notice that the tangible benefit is the idea that when people are coming to you based on these warm referrals, based on these like really qualified recommendations, they are much easier to do business with.
Right. Like, at the end of the day, if we're looking at this from a business perspective, the reason why so much business comes from referrals is because that's the easiest clothes.
If somebody that you really trust is telling me that I need to go do business with Bob, then when I take a call with Bob, you know, I'm not I'm not in there with all these guards up and thinking about and do I really trust this guy to I like this guy.
Is it for me it's more like I get there and it's is it for me. Right. You're able to get over the the like and no part of it. Right. And and and that's what I started delineating.
So when you have a system for relationships, you know, it's one thing, it's one thing to keep track of what's going on. But it's another thing you got to think about how you can be adding value at scale.
And you and I have essentially come to the same conclusion that it's content. Right. Like, if you can if you can figure out a content strategy that allows you to be adding value to people, that's going to put you ahead of the pack right now if you take another step up. And it's not just what value you have to offer to people and you treat it as how can I be introducing people to each other at scale so that you're not just adding your own value, but you're adding the value of everybody in your network around you to everybody else in your network around you.
Then you're hitting this scaling tipping point of that value exchange.
And what I realised at one point is that it all has to do with the stage and how you use a stage. Right. Like the way that you take it from one to one to one to many comes from the leverage of using a stage because you need somewhere to go, one to many. And on top of that, the stage has this psychological effect on your brain, where if you're seeing somebody on stage and you're in the audience, you're automatically attributing extra value to it.
Right. And when I say a stage, I mean the physical stage in front of you at a conference, just like I mean a television, just like I mean, hey, if I've seen you show up enough times in my Instagram feed and it's your face talking to me, that screen also serves as a stage the same way that if I read your book for eight hours, that's a stage I'm consuming you as a stage. Right.
So it's just like understanding of the the value and the practical use of applying the psychology of the stage across as much as you can. And then it's really just about how do you figure out a way to understand the value of the people around you so that you can then communicate it at scale on these stages?
I love the answer. And it really leads me very neatly to my next question, which for a lot of people I think is quite difficult, that you do a thing, you do a thing for money that a lot of other people kind of do as well. And one of the barriers, when you come to write a book or people invite you to speak or you think, OK, I'm going to go in deep on Instagram or YouTube or any of these platforms or stages, who are you showing up as?
One of the things that I've sort of heard you speak about before and we spoke a little bit about before we were recording, was this concept of category design. Who are you showing up and how would you advise anybody who is at this point where they want to be clearly known as the guy who does the thing and the thing that they love most? Not one of the ten things they could do. How would you advise them to work through that?
I know for a lot of people, it's maybe easy. For a lot of people, it's really not. I think if you're going to write a book, for example, it's a big investment of time. If you going to be promoting this book, you're going to be known for this thing. So how do you decide what that's going to be?
I don't think it's easy for a lot of people. Right.
Like, I think this is a very human question. And, you know, we talked about this a little bit before the show. You're going to find that out through iteration. Like, you're going to find that out through feedback, you're going to find it out by showing up, communicating it, understanding how it lands.
Now, to me, the tactic of how you deliver it is just as important, right? Like like at some point, you know, you're going to have to spend some time trying to figure out what am I really, really good at that I love to do.
Then you're going to once you figure that out, you need to figure out how can I use this for service?
Like, how can I how can I use this super power for the benefit of other people? When it comes to my story?
I've always been good at making friends.
I've always been good at walking into a room and gathering people around me and being able to command attention.
It wasn't until I was in those rooms in the you know, in the non-profit boards that I got involved with that I started realising this isn't about me showing up into a room and showcasing my value. It's how can I start using this to serve other people? How can I how can I use this thing to make other people feel like a ball and that they can command attention? Right. So so that is the mindset shift that you have to go into is going into service.
And then from the category design standpoint, I would recommend somebody to focus on what is the problem that they're solving and not market themselves as a solution, but market themselves as the person that most cares about this problem and the better you get. So once you're going into that iteration mode of like, all right, this is what I love doing, this is how I want to go serve people with it, start don't start talking about like, hey, man, I want to be a speaker about this.
Be Hey man, I want to figure out how people can get over this problem.
I want to figure out how, you know, businesses can learn that being relationship driven is the long term solution. Right. Like, I want to figure out how to scale relationships. Not like I'm the relationship scaling guy, because the better you get at asking those questions and the better you get at defining that problem that you're trying to solve, the more people are going to assume that you have the best answer.
And the reason it works really, really well for a guy like me is because I've never been I've always call myself a world class opener and a mediocre closer right.
Like, I'm I'm great at opening the conversation. I'm not like I care so much about the relationship that I'm never trying to talk you into something that you don't want to auto select for yourself.
And if what you're phrasing it is, is this like code and listing mission, like it's, hey, Bob, do you care about people being able to make more relationships at scale? Yes. All right. Let's solve this thing together. Right. Like this is you know, what is what is the what is the problem here?
Like, how can we define this problem the best way possible?
And to me, that's that's at the heart of category design. Right. Like they say that, you know, Brand is about yourself, right? Like when you're branding yourself, you're just like thinking about like, how do I show up when you are when you're going to category design route? It's like, how do you identify the problem? It's really more about the customer when you go into category design. Right.
It's like how how how is this a problem for you? Let's ask the right question and then you can enrol people in a mission of trying to figure out how to find that answer. And you can be the guide.
I love that. I think identifying the problem seems really simple, but it can often take you in the wrong direction. And I think the compass needle really for me was to be the person that most cares about this problem. I love that because that's really what's going to attract people is, yeah, there's lots of people who will take my money. This guy really, really, really wants to help. That will shine like a beacon. I love that.
I think something that you mentioned a couple of times and I was building relationships at scale and really when when we're talking about the Internet, we're talking about content. And I'm curious to know, what's your content journey look like? What does that look like for you?
Are you asking me kind of how I got into content or you asking me what my, like, formula for building relationships at scale is?
I'm happy to give, but I guess cutting a lot of the flimflam out, really. We're talking about video content because video content, I guess, is the content that creates real connexion in a way that other content doesn't really. So I'm probably a good example. I'm a perfectionist and this is a real problem. It's a real barrier. So if something doesn't look perfect to me, I instinctively don't want to put it out. And that held me back for a long, long, long time.
Now I just have to accept done is better than perfect. But not everybody experiences the world like that. And I'm curious to know, when you're putting out content, what are your barriers as an extrovert? What what do you get anxious about from a content perspective, these kind of thing? Yeah, no, no, no.
Listen, man, these days I don't know. Not much, because I've been doing it for. For so long, I can't say I've been doing it for so long, I've been doing it so often, right. I had the same exact issues, right, Bob? Like like I think I don't think that that's an introvert extrovert thing.
I think we're I think we're conditioned to look at content, like we look at TV, like we look at press, like we look at all these different things that are a completely different context. And people think that when they put out a piece that they're going to put out that it's going to be this thing that they get judged by forever because they only get to do so many of these. But content really is an infinite source these days based on the distribution methods that we have.
So I really believe in this concept that I learnt from one of the one of my partners in business.
These guys called The Biz Brose, the two brothers called Lewis and Lewis that have an awesome content marketing agency that they focus on repurposing.
They came up with this concept called the minimum viable content. Right. Like what is what is the minimum viable thing that you can put out that allows you to put out your content without overthinking it and look at it as a feedback mechanism?
So they right now, they're doing this thing that I'm a part of that is they call it the 45 live man.
So you go if you tell yourself I'm going to go live on Facebook for the next 45 days in a row and I'm going to talk about the stuff that I just care about.
And again, approach it from a category standpoint. I approach it from caring about a problem that you want to speak about. And it works better. Right.
But like, if you if you just tell yourself I'm going to go live on Facebook a certain amount of days in a row, I've done it for 30, I've done it for 45 at a time that will provide you that iterate of state where no one, when you go live, you completely take away that friction of perfectionism.
Right. Like as long as you're going live, you know that somebody already saw it. You're letting that thing breathe. When you are in that perfectionist kind of headspace, you are really your own judge and jury. And you're not you're only going to grow so much. Right. Like like if you're not letting your stuff get feedback on it, then really you're you are falling victim to your own skillset, to your own opinions, and you're really, really limiting yourself once you're going live.
Now you're giving people the opportunity to tell you, I like it, I don't like it, I love it. What about this? Right.
So like I look at I look at content as a as a giant feedback mechanism, the same way that I look at networking a room.
Right. Like if I can if I can walk into a room of 100 people and talk to 25 people and those 25 people, I can say, oh, man, I'm thinking about doing this like, oh, well, that sounds cool. What about this? Right.
Like it is that's that same kind of like level of friction is to see yourself as speaking out, inviting feedback and then and then use that as a feedback mechanism. Right. So, like, if if you're going live, you know that it's already out there, you know, somebody's already probably saw it.
So what's the harm in pressing publish? Right. And at the end of the day, if you do it for thirty days in a row, 45 days in a row, 60 days in a row, whatever challenge you want to put yourself at, a couple of things are going to happen. No. One, you're going to rapidly iterate and find your voice right.
Like like practising speaking for three to six to ten minutes at a time.
You're going to notice that it's not that big of a deal, too. You're going to create this like huge library of things that you can now go back and pick the best ones and really perfect them. And then and then, you know, like decide what you're going to do with them.
And three, you know, you're you're going to create all of those opportunities for feedback, like you're going to be talking directly to your network. You're going to be in this. You know, I like to use Facebook for a man because I think that Facebook has this, like, perfect mixture of people that knew you twenty years ago that you went to high school with and people that just met you at a conference last week. Right. So if you start going live and you start seeing things that that what you're saying resonates from the person that everybody always knew you were to, the person of the one that just met you thinks that you are, man, then you're really threading the needle of your zone of genius.
So I don't know if I'm answering your question, but to be perfectly honest, man, you are.
And you are. And honestly, it doesn't even matter because it was really cool. I love the idea of I love it. I'm like super terrified of it. I'm not I used to be I used to get really intimidated by any kind of live streaming. But you're right, once you do it, you realise actually this is just so easy because you don't have to prepare. There's no editing. When you press the stock button, it's done. You walk away.
Yeah, but I'm tired and I can compare it to I can again write like I base all this stuff based on this, like, non-profit stuff that I did write. And like the first couple of times I walked into a happy hour networker panel event. I was kind of terrified. But by the time you show up to the same event for the fifth time, you know that there's. Two or three people that you're going to be able to walk in and say hi to, right, and you start and you start devaluing every single conversation as much as just the art and the process of conversation and growing relationships.
And the same thing is going to happen with content, man. Like at the end of the day, what's happening in our society is that our our communication context are the way that we normally communicate with people, is evolving into a new context, all when the printing press was created all along, when radio was created, along with when television was created. And right now we're attributing the same amount of value to a Facebook live as we do to publishing a book.
But the more you do it, the more you realise it's much more like that conversation at a networking event, like it's like conversation of like walking into a room and picking a conversation with someone. Yeah, man, you're going to have a couple of conversations where you feel like what? You feel stupid about it, or maybe you didn't say the right thing or or maybe you don't like the person that you spoke to.
But the more you realise that it's really just a number of like iteration of the journey through life of conversations that you have, the more you're going to realise, well, you know, man, for every conversation that I have with somebody I don't like, there's there's there's two or three conversations of people that I'm like pretty neutral on. And then there is two or three conversations with people.
I'm like, man, this person's awesome. I want to be their friend. I want to be in their circle. Right. So, like, the same thing's going to happen with content. And and the the key to it is to continue showing up and continue iterating. Right. Because if you if you are putting out one piece of content a month, then that one piece of content really, really matters in your head.
But if you're putting out one a day, then then you're able to just take it a little bit more casual, man. And whatever you said yesterday that you feel kind of like messed up about, you can just show up the next day and be like, hey, listen, man. So yesterday I did that, but really I'm rethinking it. I'm thinking this.
And you're already showing your growth on a day to day level. And whoever is following that journey and whoever sees it is able to is able to go back in and catalogue that.
And then you get into this like effect of like this is your journal, right?
Like, if you if you are able to man up, you know how how much I would kill to read my dad's journal at 40 years old. Like, it would be incredible. Right. So or when I look at, like, the loose times that I've journal man, like, I've got a couple of times where, like, I studied abroad and that's when I was like really journaling. And I go back and I read that stuff. I'm like, man, this is awesome.
Like, look at the things, look at who I was then look at who I am now. Look at the things that I still like about myself that still here and look at how much I've grown right. It is this just like living catalogue of lessons that you can learn from yourself and other people can learn from you. So just don't be selfish about it. Like be in a service mentality of even with my flaws, whoever sees this can learn from it.
And I think that that's the major enabler, is to just approach it from a from a place of service.
I think what I really like about that is something I found quite often. Is that something you felt you said that was almost inconsequential, can land in ways you never expected. And I've had people reflect back to me years after I said something to them. You know what? That was the most powerful thing anybody ever said to me. Totally. And I'm thinking, really? Really. And I found that particularly on clubhouse recently. Have you and I go live on clubhouse sort of every other week, I think.
And it's great fun. And every time we do, I get messages afterwards saying that was really powerful. But yeah, you can't you can't predict how your content is going to land with somebody. So there's a there's a lot of volume and volume there. Yeah.
Yeah. Listen, it's the most natural thing ever, Bob. Like, we all everybody everybody underestimates the stuff that they already know as the value to other people. Right. Like there is there's this quote by Ralph Waldo Emerson that I live my life by, which is in my walks. Every man I meet is in some way my superior. And in that I can learn from them. Right. So everybody's walked a unique journey. Like, no matter you and I are very similarly aligned in the industry that we're in and the way we think about it.
But our approach to it is clearly marked by our two different paths that we've got to get there in. And no matter no matter what it is, you have some insight.
And I mean, you have a ton of insight, right? Like, I'm immediately fascinated when I met you and, like, trying to deconstruct that.
But like, everybody, everybody everybody has everybody has some unique perspective, experience, you know, something that they've worked harder on that they've that they've thought about longer on that they've, you know, haven't thought about it. Also, they ask the dumb question that you just, like, assumed that you shouldn't ask.
But everybody has some little bit of value that that is useful to somebody else. Right. And it's it seems really easy to accept that about everybody else. But you got to accept that about yourself to write like my my first my first foray into content was making my networking. You know, speaking point's right, I, I originally called him my networking superchargers, and within him are some really, like, high level stuff about how I purposefully will go to the same restaurant for like six weeks.