I've seen a lot of advertising disasters over the years but I've also seen some spectacular wins. This week my guest is one of the smartest advertisers I know and this show is a treat for anyone who's looking to level up Facebook ads or start dipping your toe in Facebook messenger marketing. I made a lot of notes in this interview so I suggest you sharpen a pencil, grab a coffee and get ready to look at Facebook ads in a whole new light.
This week my guest is Carrie Gottschalk, on of the worlds leading Facebook ads consultants and she's going to open the curtain on her business, services and some really cool strategies you can start implementing right away.
Carrie is a highly recognized influencer within the social media industry and has been at the forefront of the social media revolution for 12 years, paid social media for 5 years, and has managed over 13 million dollars in ad-spend -- working with large clients Shari's Berries, Wyndham Hotels, and TEDxMileHigh. With her extensive experience in domestic and international markets she's known as a skilled social media strategist, advertiser and has also gained a strong understanding of digital performance metrics with a good portion of her experience in eCommerce, Direct Response, and Performance Marketing.
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Take Carrie's chatbot for a spin : https://m.me/carriegottschalkllc
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Automatic Show Transcript
I've seen a lot of advertising disasters over the years. But I've also seen some spectacular wins. This week. My guest is one of the smartest advertisers I know. And it's gonna be a real treat for anyone who's looking to level up their Facebook ads, or start dipping your toe into Facebook Messenger marketing. I made a lot of notes in this interview. So I suggest you hit pause, sharpen a pencil, grab a coffee, and get ready to look at Facebook ads in a whole new light. This week, my guest is Carrie got Chuck, one of the world's leading Facebook ads consultants, and she's going to open up the curtain on her business, her services and some really cool strategies you can start implementing straightaway. I there and welcome back to amplify the digital marketing entrepreneur podcast. I'm Bob Gentle, and every Monday I'm joined by amazing people who share what makes their business work. If you're new to the show, then take a second
Right now to subscribe, so you don't miss new episodes. And you can grab some older ones when you're finished with this one. Don't forget to join our Facebook community. Just visit amplify me.fm forward slash insiders. And you'll be taken right there. So welcome along, and let's meet Carrie.
So this week, my guest is carry cultural carry. Do you want to maybe start just by introducing a little bit about who you are, where you are and the kind of work you do? Hi, first, yeah, so I am in Denver, Colorado. And what I do is I primarily focus on Facebook and Instagram, e commerce advertising for health, wellness and athletes, your clients. And in addition to that, when Facebook opened up the destination to also market to messenger back in 2017, I started to learn how to use messenger and build chat bots for all of my clients as well as
That's something that I share and speak about how to do at conferences all around the world. I think you are one of two people I've met probably in the last couple of years, though, when I meet them, think, Wow, this person is great fun, very entertaining.
But it's only when I get back home, I realized, holy cow, they're also really, really smart. Because when you meet at a conference in something like that, a lot of the time you're not really focused on the business talk. But you really do some business. Yeah. So where did we meet? It was in London, which conference was it was Chris Duckers conference? Yeah. And that was a lot of fun.
But yeah, so a lot of the times when I try to explain what I do, people do understand the e commerce side of running ads on Facebook and that's something that I just absolutely love. It's very easy to make the client happy. Especially when you
You just spent 10,000 and made them 50,000. You have a happy client at the end of the day. The other thing though, that is a challenge is explaining how messenger marketing works. And people tend to think it's its whole own bubble. It's its own business. But really, it's just an extension of Facebook advertising. But instead of sending them to a landing page or to a website, you're sending them into messenger and you're able to actually engage, nurture, educate and messenger and build that relationship and have those conversations that are a little bit more personal that end up actually assisting in sales. So it works really well for new and prospective customers. And a lot of the people that I do messenger marketing for that kind of got me started was for events. So that's where I first saw it being used for digital marketers selling tickets to TNC I saw Facebook
doing it for their f8 conference. And then my first client that I tested out on in 2017 was for TEDx. And it was just really exciting people got in, they asked questions about the events, we followed up with them. Maybe a few months later, ask them if they wanted to buy new tickets to the next event as edit discounted re and we saw really great results. So it still was a type of conversion based campaign. I see a lot of people using messenger bots, actually on their website, as well as I probably see the narrative because more often than I'm on the receiving end of a Facebook ad driven messenger bot. And I often wonder, do you find that there's maybe a section of the population that's resistant to messenger bots? Or do you think that's maybe something we think that there is but actually reality is when the bots well designed, people are actually quite happy to engage with it? I think the latter is
True, a lot of people aren't familiar with them and how they work. And what just happened actually on March 4 is mini chat. That's primarily who I work with put a lot of new rules and restrictions in. So like any new marketing channel, it's always fun in the beginning until marketers ruin it by sending out too many messages or broadcasts. So they want to make sure that it's being used appropriately. And when you said that you see it on websites, the messenger funnel and flows have a lot of different growth tools. So if you're not seeing it in a Facebook ad, you could still see it at an event on a poster board with a QR code. Or you could install a rough URL or a short link at the bottom of an email where they could click on it and start chatting. Or you could put that snippet of code on the website and use it for customer service where they can chat on site. And it all goes into the same place. And that place right now it's Facebook Messenger and how it works and why it's
been so successful especially in the beginning, is that we don't ever want to trick people. But uh, you know, if you hit a landing page and you give your email you automatically know you're in their email marketing system. What people weren't realizing at first is that if they messaged a business page first on Facebook, that automatically made them a Facebook Messenger subscriber. And fortunately, what was happening is many chat had the broadcast tool where you could send out messages to them. They weren't supposed to be promotional, but people were breaking those rules and sending discounts and flash sales and that's really not how it's meant to be used in the beginning. You can put promotions on the back end, but what you really want to do when you get a new person into messenger is have a conversation with them ask some questions, find out their preferences, and then after you've engaged with them and gone through that like know and trust factor and then you can start pushing sales or distance
counts. And that's why that TEDx TEDx example was so well or what so well is because we engaged with them at the event, we gave them the schedule, we gave them speaker information, we gave them lunch information, we give them information about where the after party was. Then we followed up with them and asked them what they thought of the event so that we could get their feedback. Then we followed up with them again, and let them know when all of the sessions were live on YouTube. So if they missed any they could watch them. And then we followed up again and said, You are the first to know about our speaker releases for next event. So they got a lot of information that was valuable to them. Before we came in, maybe on the fifth or sixth message and said, we're about ready to release ticket sales. We have a limited number for 40% off, would you like this offer. So again, we weren't pushing the offer on them. We were asking them if they wanted it, which is how messengers should be used opposed to
ecommerce advertising. And when you put an ad out for e commerce, it's usually like here's our product, click to buy it now on site. But for messenger, you don't want to do add to messenger to sale you want to do add to conversation nurturing, building that relationship then to sale. I was listening to what you were talking about how to get people, and your example was for an event into that messenger flow. And yeah, my, my mind was doing cartwheels with so many ideas that why don't many chat explain it like that.
It's it makes so much sense the way you described it there. One thing that has puzzled me is, again, from from an online perspective, how to get people into that messenger flow. I think when you're when you're in person in which perversely you think in person in the physical world, it should be more difficult, but actually, I think the way
You described it there, it sounds much easier. But the way that you instinctively think that it would be done is Facebook add to Facebook Messenger flow.
But that's exactly what you said, just now that you shouldn't do if I took things correctly, you should do add the messenger flow. But once they get into messenger, you shouldn't be trying to sell them on the first message. Right? So what a lot of people do and some of the most successes that I've had with messenger and especially a messenger opt in strategies, is to make it fun and engaging. You can put an ad up that says hi, do you want 40% off of tickets and you'll get a code which is okay, but what's more fun is to quiz people or survey people or ask them questions. So especially if you're giving away something, giving away something for free, like TEDx, we'd ask people if they wanted a free backstage
past with their ticket purchases so that it wouldn't prevent a sale. Or if they wanted an upgrade to a VIP or meet the speakers or something high value low cost to us. And it also always required them having a ticket. But another thing a little bit more creative that I've done is, for example, I had a supplement company and how do you make selling calcium sexy?
So we were targeting woman over 55 on Facebook with an ad. And what we were doing is we're asking them, are you getting enough calcium? Take our quiz to find out. And then throughout the quiz process, we were asking them which food or product they thought had more calcium and what we were actually trying to do is educate them about plant base calcium versus dairy base since the whole dairy campaign was back in the 50s. And we really wanted people to get away from drinking a gallon of milk a day and you know eating more healthy greens.
So, through the quiz that not only showed them which kind of food had more calcium also added up a score, we gave them a score at the end, we asked them if they'd want custom recommendations sent to them or consulting call. So we were able to also get their email. So then we had a double opt in, of not only a messenger subscriber, but also an email subscriber. And then after that we followed up with, Hey, thanks for taking the quiz. Here's a discount code for 15% off if you'd like to purchase calcium on site. And that worked better. Oh, sorry. No, carry on. Oh, that worked better having the offer on the back end of the conversation than having it on the front end. So when I said again, you don't want to do add a messenger to sale you don't want to do the messenger to discount code because they do just feel like they're being sold. But if you do they add the messenger to quiz to conversation to recommendations then to discount code. That's how we saw the most sick
That makes much more sense. Yes, now I've got it. And that whole quiz process is that taking place within the messenger bot is and what's really nice too is you can set the messenger bot up really quite easily and quickly. And I know Kelly noble has a lot of videos, and most of them are under 10 minutes. So you could just watch a video, figure it out and have it set up within probably a half hour.
But outside of setting it up within mini chat, you also can export all that data and put together some very, very easy custom integrations. So I could connect that quiz to Google Sheets, and have the user name, email and the survey.
Result questions all put in that way I could have a custom profile put together for that person. And that way when we sent them recommendations, we could see what food they were picking and what their score is. You all
can do a higher level integration where you put it into a CRM that just might require a zap. Or you can also connect it to a native integration like MailChimp, and put together a custom list and MailChimp in the second they submit their email, it'll auto import to MailChimp, and then you can put an email drip campaign behind it too. I hope people are writing this down. That's so good. One question I have. And you're probably the best person to ask this. And this has puzzled me over the years and I kind of came to my own answers is you see online, almost two camps. There's the build a personal brand content marketing community. And then there are the people who are just trying to face themselves Facebook add themselves to wealth. And I'm curious to know from your perspective, as somebody who spends a lot of money on ads, other people's money, hopefully, what does is that impact are other benefits to having a really strong brand as an adult
And I know this sounds like a stupid question. But there are lots of people who spent a lot of money on Facebook ads that will just say, well, you just need to interrupt to scroll with a random image, make an offer, and you can sell something I see this literally sad like that all the time. Do you understand the question? Yeah. Are you talking about as a personal brand, like if I were to run for myself, are you talking about as client positioning? Well, I try to do this without naming names, because you'll know exactly what I'm talking about. If I have an offer, and I get that offer in front of the right person, I managed to stop their schooling, make my pitch and have the conversion process in place for them. That's one thing. But if that's coming from a recognized brand, whether that be personal or corporate,
as an advertiser spending money, what's the difference to you? So technically, people are not set up for success if they just
Put one ad out and hope that first ad converts. What makes advertising really successful especially in e commerce advertising is you want to make sure you're pushing people through the full funnel, from awareness, consideration conversion hot, warm and cold. So what I do with a lot of my clients is I have funnel setup, I'll have a level one, a level two, or level three or level four. Level one is going to be pure prospecting, acquisition cold audience. So I might put a lot of look alike audiences in there and might put a lot of different interests personas, start testing them out, and also have exclusion audiences in there to make sure I'm not targeting anyone on that level that already knows who I am that has been to my site that knows my product. What that allows me to do is hit allows me to hit that new audience first. And if that new audience decides to click, engage, interact, watch a video. Go to site, I then can create different levels of custom audiences to put on those other different levels to
Three and Four. Four is usually going to be purely retargeting. Two is going to be that they kind of know who you are, they've liked your page, they've engaged with your post three is going to be like, three, level three is going to be a lot warmer, that means that they've spent 25% of time on site, they've watched 70% of your video or something. So when you start to move people through that funnel, what that allows them to do is get it allows them to get closer to the path to purchase. So on that first level, what I might do, and I think I was telling you about this client, before we jumped on that interview, but I have a client that has a 3d printer for kids right now, which is performing amazing, unfortunately, because everyone's stuck at home with their kids right now. But what it's doing is it's actually solving a problem for parents. It's allowing parents to keep their kids entertained at home, educate assistants.
I'm learning. And that ad that I serve up on level one is going to be more of an informational video. This is our product. This is how our product works. These are product reviews, it's our product features. This is a really happy kid entertained by the product. What I can do from there is then create a warm audience that of anyone that might have watched one of those videos and I really like to use videos on level one because they can communicate so much more so much faster and visually than any plain text and static image head. Then from there when they get into the warmer audiences and even up to the retargeted audiences. That's when we say this weekend only save 20%
buy a new bundle, which means you buy that printer and printer food. So that after getting them through educating them them seeing it quite a bit. That's when we really hit our stride and success with those purchases.
While also happens a lot because this is a little bit higher ticket item. And if you think about social media and Facebook, a lot of it is kind of disrupting that newsfeed and it is about discoverability people are going to be able to buy something on a discoverability factor within a day if it's under $50. Most people can afford that. But because this product is about 350 to $400, I'll see a lot of add to carts, and then I'll see quite a few initiated checkouts, but then only a fraction of them purchased. So that means they might be sitting on their wallet and waiting a week or two, but then they come back and buy it. So I always have a retargeted audience set up to for anyone that has added to cart initiate checkout or abandon their cart without purchasing so then they also get a reminder ad saying hey, you forgot something. Did you know you can buy it this weekend for a discount. So those are all different ways to
advertise, I guess a little bit more properly, to get people through the funnel and to educate them as opposed to saying, here's my offer, please buy it.
Now, that makes a lot of sense. And I'm real. My question previously was a little bit inarticulate. But the client that you were talking about just now, with a 3d printer for kids, you mentioned to me earlier that they'd been on Shark Tank. And I guess a question is, did that Shark Tank branding being associated with that product? Does that have an impact on how effective your ads can be? It did before the pandemic, a lot of what we were running was as featured on Shark Tank. But we repositioned with all of the stay at home orders to actually show happy kids to talk to parents and a lot of our copy changed from as seen on Shark Tank to keeping your kids entertained at home and assistance.
in STEM learning, and ever since we did that transition, we actually have gotten from probably a three to four row as up to an average of seven, eight to 12. Row as a day with all of this. Yeah, that's quite impressive.
And one thing I can I'm curious about is some ecommerce in particular people, they go straight to advertising,
and that there's nothing wrong with that. But what I do wonder is,
if you have a client that's been quite active in terms of content marketing, does that bring you any benefit as an advertiser?
Yes, and no. So what I do when I take on an e commerce client is I not only I'll evaluate the site, I'll see how many products they'll have. I'll see how much their products cost, what their margins our shipping costs, except, like, that's all important, but I'll also see if I'm making
To set up all of those audiences successfully. So those audiences being set up successfully within that funnel that I was just talking about, depends on how much data is there. So if that client has no content on their Facebook, and no fans, that limits me from setting up a custom audience of all fans or setting up a custom audience of all engagers, or if they have no videos that limits me from setting up a custom audience based on video views. Another thing is also site traffic. So if you're not putting content on your site, or driving traffic to your site, that limits my audience that I can retarget first site traffic or time on site. So having those things in place first is actually extremely valuable. And if you do have those things in place first, but there's still as lower data points.
I honestly recommend the first
month that you just go in, it could be low budget because some of the metrics are extremely cheap. But go boost a video for $100. And most of the time, you can get a video view at a penny per view, go boost some of your content First, if you boost a content or boost the content on page, you can get those engagements again from a couple cents to 20 cents. But once you get all those engagements on that post, then you can create a custom audience off of those engagements. The other thing that you can do also to double dip a little bit on those engagements because they are so cheap is everyone then that engaged with that post. If you click on that number, it'll open up a whole list of all of those people and then you can invite them to like the page. So now you're not only paying for your post engagements, but you're getting page fans for free by making the effort to invite them to the page. I would never have thought of that.
That's such a good idea. Yeah, cuz fan campaigns can be expensive. I've seen fan campaigns cost anywhere from one to $5. So I recommend people boosting their content and then inviting people to like the page. And my eyes are literally watering.
Yeah, that helps with all the numbers. And then once you have a decent audience size that has engaged, which videos that on your site, then you're going to be set up a little bit better for success when it comes to trying to run a conversion based campaign.
That is exactly the answer I was looking for. That's such a good answer to that question. It's good.
I guess this is going to be one of Bob's daft guy questions. But I'm curious to know from you.
If a small business owner because many of my listeners are small business owners be that sort of independent consultants or local businesses. Yeah, we have some corporate listeners, but
The majority of businesses are very small. What's the first thing if they've never really spent any time learning about Facebook ads? There's quite a lot to learn. Where would you suggest they spend their time first. I always recommend people go to Facebook blueprints and start to look around at some of the modules on there. If you're brand new to Facebook advertising, you need to understand what the campaigns can pay and objectives are, so that you're selecting the right campaign. And you also need to know again, I'm going to go back to audiences but how it affects your audiences because what's gonna make you the most successful is knowing who to target
and doing it extremely prepared, so that it assists each other. So you know that if you boost a video that allows you to create a custom audience off of those video views
Then that allows you to create a look alike audience off of those video views. So out of one single boost, that could be really cheap, especially for a small business, if they only want to boost the video for 20 to $50. They need to know what kind of data that's creating for them and how they can use it to their advantage. By creating that custom audience off of all video views, you now have a warm audience who already knows who you are, and that will help them get closer to the path to purchase. And then by creating that look alike audience that'll also help you prospect. A little bit more prepared Lee, a lot of people will go in and say I just want to target people in London from a five mile block radius outside my store that are men and women age 30 to 50 interested let's say it's a pet shop, you know that you're interested in pets or animals.
You can do that but you
You're still guessing because there could be a lot of people that live dogs that don't own a dog.
But if you get people to watch the video and get them on the site, I probably won't go to your pet shops website if I don't have a dog. But if I do see that video, if I do have a dog, and then if I go to the site, that's probably meaning, I'm more likely to buy from you because I wouldn't be on your site if I didn't have to buy toys for or something like that, you know. So getting that custom data out of everything you're doing is just so important. And it's good to run a variety of campaigns and knowing that they can all build into each other if you run a web traffic campaign to get your site or your site traffic up. If you run a video campaign, like I was just saying to get views to educate if you run an engagement campaign to see who's engaging with your content the most and inviting them to become a fan. Those people that actually say yes, I'm going to become a fan.
Probably are actually a lot more inner
Did you then the person that just engaged with it that didn't accept the fan. So being able to put all of those audience together, and then using that, just to assist in what you're trying to do, I guess would be what I would say would be the most important part. And why I keep going to the audience data to, especially with people trying to sell online, is the rule of thumb is you need traffic before conversions. And too many people want to start at the bottom of the funnel. They want to say, here's my ad, here's a conversion campaign, our traffic campaign, go buy something. And they want to do that without getting people all the way through the funnel. If I don't know, you know,
anything about you, if I haven't engaged with your content, I'm probably not going to buy from you. So running a conversion campaign is just going to waste a lot of time and money, if that's the only thing you do or if that's where you first start. So
I recommend auditing that content that they're already doing, trying to see what content is performing well, and what content isn't performing well.
I love Larry cam. And I don't know if you've ever listened to one of his talks. They're quite entertaining. But he always says, boost unicorns and not donkeys.
Basically, if content is doing well amplify it, if content isn't doing well learn from it, but don't force it. When it comes to ad spend. I really liked what you said about everybody wants to advertise to the bottom of the funnel. superficially, it makes sense to try and sell your products through an ad. But actually, if you look at everything else in digital marketing, you're talking about getting people to take that first step into your funnel, and then nurture them down. But when we look at advertising, so many people are, as you said, to trying to advertise from way up above the funnel way down to the very bottom.
It's going to be so hit I miss is such an elegant way of advertising you described. I really like that. I'm curious. And I'm curious a lot because your industry is one that's fascinating for me. But I have a client who's not actually a client yet. They will be. But they've been working. And I think this is this happens a lot where a web design company will simply put on their website. We also do face back Facebook ads, we also do Google ads, we also do SEO. So this client has spent what's for them a reasonable amount of money with very little return.
And I think that's very common. What are the most and you're probably in a position of having to catch that ball quite often when somebody else has dropped it.
What are the most common mistakes that people at the entry level we take money for Facebook ads market tend to make
Sorry. What do you mean by that? Well, you're quite a sophisticated Facebook advertiser who really focuses on doing that a lot. If somebody has simply come to the conclusion, well, I know a little bit more than the customer, so I'll be okay. What are the most common mistakes? You see people who take money for Facebook advertising make when they're at that sort of entry level, small business? So they take on this client type of thing? No, they have taken on that client and they've screwed it up. Um, one of the most common ways you see semi professional is screwing up other people's Facebook.
Ad guess what happens? A lot of the time when something doesn't perform well, it means they didn't qualify the client properly, or they need to look past the Facebook ads. So for an example is I took on a high end fashion jeweler in New York City. That was the norm
trims, Neiman sacks, they had an established brand, a huge budget, I qualified them. And I was like this is going to do amazing. I'm so excited. And once we ran the spend, and I think we started off with a $500,000 test, within a couple of days, we saw that
the ads working. So the first thing you look at is are my ads performing? Do I have enough clicks? What's my cost per click? What's my click through rate? And I was like, okay, the ads are working. But then whereas like what is going on? was we had an insanely high level number of add to carts, but very low initiated checkouts and no purchases. So it's knowing how to look at the numbers all the way through the campaign. One are my ads working. So you can tell by those three numbers. Yes, the ads are working or they're not working, then is that we're
On the back end, so that high number add to carts, but low number initiated checkouts or purchases made me say, Okay, I need to look at the website, what happens when I add a product to cart.
And what was happening is that client had decided the day I started the test to put a new banner on their website. And that banner was covering up the cart.
So, people were adding product to cart, but they had no indicator that it actually got added to the cart. So they're clicking on it 15 times. And then they didn't realize that they added that same product to their cart, and then they couldn't find the cart even to checkout. That's a very unique example. But
it's also like I was qualifying a client, someone said you do e commerce, you should advertise my friend's hot sauce. And it was like send me there.
website, let me look at it. And they had about five different hot sauces. So very low skews. Usually you want a client that has more than, I don't know, I like clients that have more than 50 skews or products on site. But they only only had five hot sauces. I think it was $12 a bottle. But then you went to add it to cart. And then you went to check out and when you went to check out, they wanted $8 for shipping.
So those are other things, you know, just going through the path to purchase, what could hang people up and no one's gonna pay
more than half of the cost of the product on shipping.
So that turned it into a $20 bottle. The posts were $12 bottle and $8 compared to $12 is almost the cost of the product itself. So it's just little things when bringing someone on finding out
Where if this did get screwed up where and why. So is that the ads is that the placement is that the bidding is that
Facebook sometimes when you select campaigns when they're not converging, even if you're doing traffic, the bid optimization at the bottom of the ad set might default to impressions opposed to a bidding on clicks. So you don't want to run? Well, you do and you don't in certain cases, you don't want to run a website clicks campaign that's bidding on impressions when your ultimate goal is to get traffic. So it's just double and triple checking how everything's set up has an optimizing even something as little as knowing your attribution window. How I was saying earlier products under $50 people can usually buy so that's a one day bid one day click something around 80 to 150 may be a seven day attribution window. Something about
Three to 500, which makes it harder for that impulse purchase might be a 28 day window. So just a bunch of little things, you have to think about buying behavior and think about how you'd purchase an item if you served yourself bad as well. No, that's a really good answer. A lot to think about him there. He has Sorry, my mind just goes all over the place when I start to explain things. Well, that's why you're a guest on the podcast.
I'd like to dig into your own business a little bit and particularly, how you build your own personal brand. How you reach your customer, basically, I know you do a lot of speaking, you go to a lot of events. I can make some assumptions, but I'm often surprised how leftfield some things can be. I find most people their business comes either through referral or it comes through content marketing or direct selling, or ads. What does that typically look like for you? So I am terrible at putting out content. I do not run my own.
a lot of what happened that I felt made me successful. And I think it just kind of all came together. And it was never planned. But when I went independent three years ago, I'm entering my fourth year of business. I said, What am I going to do? What am I going to offer? I'm not a full service agency. And then I said, Well, wait, what do I like to do? I don't like to write content, but I'm in social media. But I do like to run ads. So I said, I am only going to run ads for my clients. I'm not going to offer them anything else except being a media buyer. And then I was getting people that wanted me to boost posts and do some of these lower budget things that I wasn't seeing an actual return on and it was hard to measure. So then I said, I'm only going to run e commerce ads.
And that went well too. But I realized with all of the different types of clients, it was a constant
change of thought process.
So then I said, What industries do I like?
And I liked health, wellness and athleisure. I'm an active person, I live in Colorado, I go hiking,
I work out and I was like, I like this stuff. Why don't I just market it. So from there I niched even further into health, wellness and athleisure. And what started to happen was it sped up the learning process. So if I found a funnel for a campaign for leggings that worked really well, I could go reapply that that to the Vikings clothes company, and then I could go reapply that to the running VM company. And also what happened from there is once I got into the health, wellness and athleisure space with e commerce ads, I had a bunch of case studies for similar type clients and they felt more confident hiring me knowing that I had the experience in their industry. What also is nice about that, especially the leisure side is if
We were marketing a new pair of leggings. That model usually wouldn't be standing barefoot, she'd have shoes off, or a jacket or something. And that client would then refer me to the shoe person. And then I'd be running ads for the shoe person and bring them on as a new client, then the shoe person would have another clothing clothing line that they'd partner with and would refer you to that other clothing line.
Because not all people that do clothing, do the same type of clothing, but they do have to pair it with a different type of clothing. Your shoes probably came from one store where your jacket probably came from another store where your jeans probably came from another store. So that made it really easy to learn, scale and grow very quickly and to get referrals. And then because I've been doing this for so long, I noticed that I had a very high
client rate they weren't turning over and the only time I ever really lost
client was if they left to go to a new company and if a new cmo came in and said, We just want to put this all in an agency and not manage 15 consultants, well, then that client that left that went to a different company would still bring me over with them. And then that new Titleist would also have more clients and they refer me over and over and over. So it was always just asking, you know, this is going well, do you have anyone else you're working with that you can refer me to? also knowing up front? I always ask when I sign a contract, can I get a case study out of this? Or is there an NDA? If there is an NDA? How can we turn this around into a case study with saying it was a leggings company instead of it was this brand Is this okay? type of thing? Yeah. And then, yeah, that pretty much is how it was able just to grow and how to get clients without making a lot of effort to really average high
Or pitch or anything like that it was just keeping track of results and honestly just asking for it.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai