Social media marketing can feel like a hamster wheel sometimes. You always have to be on your content game.

Just when you think you have it nailed down - the well is dry again. As your business grows, the value of your time climbs and spending time on social becomes more costly and sometimes less effective. 

This week my podcast guest is Tamika Awai and she's talking me through how she helps niche business influencers develop an evergreen content layer which does two key things. 

It cuts through the noise and delivers the key messaging you need. Tamika's message could really help take the pressure off your social media. 

She's changed the way I think about social content and hopefully, she'll bring you a new perspective too.

About Tamika

Tamika is the CEO of Orisha Creative, an inventive nurture marketing agency that serves leaders in the online coaching industry and creator of The Nurture Matrix™, a unique evergreen nurture marketing framework that’s revolutionizing the way the Master Coaches approach social media and email marketing. 

She hails from Ontario, Canada on the lands first owned by the Mississaugas of the Credit First Nation with her husband and children. She can often be found swooning over her Spotify Daily Mix in a hot bubble bath or trying to perfect her oyster shucking game.


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Automatic Audio Transcription

Social media marketing can feel like a hamster wheel. Sometimes you always have to be on your content game and just when you think you've got it nailed down, the well is dry again. And as your business grows, the value of your time climbs and spending time on social media becomes more and more costly and sometimes less and less effective as you spread more thin. This week, my guest is Tamika Auwai, and she's talking me through how she helps niche business influencers develop an evergreen content layer which ties to key things.

It cuts through the noise and it delivers the key messaging you need to make. His message could really help take the pressure off your social media. She's changed the way I think about social media content. And hopefully she'll bring you a new perspective to. Hi there. And welcome back to Amplify the Digital Marketing Entrepreneur podcast. I'm Bob Gentle, and every Monday I'm joined by amazing people who share what makes their business work. If your new take a second right now to subscribe in your player so you don't miss new episodes and you can grab some older ones when you're done with this one.

Don't forget as well. You can join my Facebook community, just visit, amplify me forward, slash insiders, and you'll be taken right there. So welcome along. And let's meet Tamika this week. I'm delighted to welcome Tamika Auwai to this show. Temeka and I are going to be speaking all things nurture, which is like super exciting. Temeka, why don't you start just by introducing who you are, where you are and the kind of work you do?

Sure, absolutely, Bob. I am based in Canada and I run a natural marketing agency called Reesha Creative. We work almost exclusively with coaches and teachers and thought leaders and we help them build out nurture marketing that keeps them off of the content creation treadmill, you know, so not churning out endless content all the time. And we help them to fill their their premium programs, their coaching programs in record time as a result. Because, Bob, as we will chat about more nurture, better nurture, more strategic nurture, it does the job of closing the sale a whole lot more seamlessly.

So you work, I think, a lot of the time with people who understand what nurture marketing is. So let's come back to that in a little while. So for the for the business owner who's listening to this podcast thinking, oh, I want to I want to understand this digital marketing business, what's your definition of nurture marketing? How do you explain it to people who have never heard of it before?

Yeah, absolutely. So nurture marketing for me is the sort of process by which we really engage folks who are new to our world. So new, you know, new leads, new new folks come into our communities and it's the process by which we help them prepare to make a buying decisions where we love on them. We build relationships and ultimately to position ourselves, you know, where it's true. But we position position ourselves as the best provider to solve whatever problem they've showed up in our communities to have solved.

And I'm quite accustomed to hearing about email. This nurturing is your work predominantly sort of in the email space. Ah, what sort of formats and platforms are you usually operating in.

Yeah, that's that's a great question as well. So email nurture is certainly part of what we do, but we also see nurture taking place on social media. Right. We've got to in this sort of world where we have cluttered inboxes and, you know, everyone's screaming for attention or looking for the way to be able to connect with folks across the platforms that they that they can build a relationship with us. So will support clients within our marketing on email and social media primarily.

And we do have a handful of clients who, you know, not not in twenty twenty, but who have done more of an in-person business. And so there are ways to nurture relationships through live events as well.

Right. I guess the reason I'm trying I'm asking a few kind of daft lady questions we call them in this country is in order that the list I can get a really clear understanding of what we're talking about. So you spoke about sort of getting off the content creation, hamster wheel through nurture marketing, and I'm keen to dig into that a little bit because podcasting is a hamster wheel. Blogging is a hamster wheel. YouTube is a hamster wheel. You have to show up week after week after week after week of creating content, which is fine if you love it.

And frankly, I love doing this podcast. It's about much more than content creation. It's about relationship building. It's about knowledge building. And on the podcast the listener listens to, it's like it's almost a by product, but for the average. Very busy coach for the very busy business owner. Time is probably the biggest barrier they have. So explain to me how you rescue people from this treadmill.

Yeah, absolutely. You know, you're right. Like, if you love these things, if you love podcasting, if you love being up on social media 24/7, if you love YouTube, any of those pieces, if it's a labor of love, there maybe isn't anything to do. But to your point, so many people are business owners like they're super busy and they don't actually love the process of content creation or they don't love the feeling that they have to be, you know, cranking something out new every single day or week, depending on on the platform.

So what we do differently and sort of the new way to look at nurture that I like to introduce to folks is that when you get really clear about the messaging that your ideal client needs to hear like it, you know, the messages they need to see, hear, understand, if you know sort of the beliefs that they need to take on to be in a you know, in an open position, ready to, you know, to buy and solve whatever problem it is that they have.

If you know what that messaging is, you can kind of collapse down that the amount of content that you need to create. If you center on those themes and you can repurpose a lot. Right. So you get into this place where you can be really in service of your community, but narrowing down the number of messages that are actually going out. And when you do that as a byproduct, you don't really have to be creating something new all the time, like the folks who really love content creation, who love podcasting or, you know, having a YouTube channel.

You'll notice that they are usually having like a different conversation every week or they are having content, what I call popcorn content, like little bite sized tips and tricks and, you know, little things that people can sort of digest, you know, each day or each week. Right. That's how they can be in that place of high frequency content production. And, you know, they love it. That's that's fine. Instead, when we flip them, we really focus on the core messaging that needs to go out from a marketing perspective.

And we focus just on that. We realize, look, we don't have to say something new every single day or every single week. We can actually just ensure that our ideal clients are receiving those messages that they need to receive. And then we can start to play with having evergreen content or having and repurposing content. And so, you know, the thing that our agency is is known for is building out something I call the nurture matrix. And it's a 90 day evergreen nurture sequence that rolls across email and social media.

And it is all rooted in this sort of what are those core messages that people need to receive over and over? You know, in the only sort of the kind of the next question that a lot of people have, Bob, is for like, well, aren't people going to get tired of seeing the same messaging? And, you know, since we're so used to kind of prolific content creators who will create new content every day or every week, and that high frequency, the average business owner doesn't know that there's another way to do things.

And they actually think that the only way to do it is this. Like, I need an editorial calendar, I need three hundred and sixty five days of content. I need to be producing all these things for all these different platforms, you know. But the truth is, if you're if you laser in on what a new lead needs to receive to be guided into the place where they're ready to make a buying decision, all they actually need are the core nurture messages that are going to take them there.

So you can simplify things a whole heck of a lot if you let go of the idea that, like, my audience needs to receive all this, all this stuff and really just focus on what's like the meat and potatoes instead of kind of the popcorn, you know, or amuse Bush. You know, what is the meat and potatoes messaging that an ideal client needs to receive? And we've seen some really incredible results for our agency clients, streamlining things this way.

So this is a really nice way of looking at things I think a lot of people are used to, as you said, the editorial calendar. They need to be creating content all the time. And I kind of think they should. But the frequency that a lot of people feel that they need to sustain, I think is a lot higher than is reasonable for most business owners. And I like your idea of looking at what does the prospect need to know?

What are the core messages that you need to be sort of dropping almost like breadcrumbs that lead towards that buying decision, that that point of conversion. If you really focus in on those breadcrumbs, actually, you need to be repetitive. You need to be sort of saying the same things in lots of different ways in order for them to finally go, oh, yeah, you're the guy. Because as you said, most people, they're not sitting there consuming our content all day.

They get little encounters here and there. For most content creators, those encounters are going to be different every time you got to be talking about different things. And for the potential prospect, you haven't been consistent. You've been consistently visible, but you haven't been consistently saying the same thing again and again. And really being clear on this is who I am is what I do. This is the problem. I softeners who I'm for. So I really like that.

When you talk about the 90 day nurture sequence, is that a sequence that you repeat or that you sort of recreate or is it sort of 90 days and then, OK, next 90 day plan?

Right. That's a great question. So it you know, it's it's a framework more than like a formula that we that we operate with. So it is a little bit different for each client, kind of depending on who their audiences and also their own sort of, you know, desire or sort of affinity for content creation. But generally we do repeat it, you know, quarterly. So it'll roll out three or four times a year. And it really acts for a lot of our clients as like foundational content, because the truth is, the folks that are most attracted to our work are actually really great content creators.

They're brilliant content creators, but they get to a place in their business where they want to perhaps channel their creativity into another direction. You know, we work with a lot of folks who have aspirations to author books or to take time off to become, you know, really polished speakers and deliver a TED talk or, you know, there could be any number of things that they want to do with their creativity. And so it's not that they don't want to create content and that they want to channel their creativity elsewhere.

So what's really cool is that with our 90 day sequence and when we have it rolling out on repeat sort of as a foundation, they don't have to worry about, you know, showing up like, you know, they don't have to get into that place of, oh, my goodness, we don't know what we're saying for the next month or, oh, my goodness, I've got to, you know, lock myself away and, you know, channel all my energy over and creating content.

They've got the foundational content rolling out and then they get to show up as they feel inspired to. And so that happens a lot. But it typically is repeated for a lot of our clients, at least three or four times a year across social media and then on email, it tends to be twice, like once or twice. They usually get it when they first, not when they first join a list. But if you can imagine, you know, they sign up for whatever free lead magnet or opt in.

It's available and they'll get whatever little intro sequence comes there. And then if they don't make an immediate decision to either get on a call or by the initial offer or whatever, the thing is, they are presented this this nurture sequence and it rolls out usually around a weekly email, usually around 12 weeks, although again, we've got clients who might do it a little differently depending on their and their marketing calendar, but that rolls off across across email.

And then they might do it another time in the year, maybe just prior to whatever sort of major active enrollment campaign they have. So the frequency looks like that on email and then on social media. Again, know social is the place where frequency does matter. And you're right, they do need to receive your audience does need to receive messages every single day. So that's the place where we will repeat it maybe three or four times. And, you know, it's to be totally transparent.

It's not usually the only content that rolls out, but again, that sort of relief of not having to come up with the new message every day or not to have to come up with the editorial calendar often for most business owners, creates space. And in that sort of white space, the creativity drops in and they're sort of like, oh, it would be really cool to do this. Or maybe for the first time they realized, OK, with my core content rolling out of my corner, nurture messages rolling out, maybe I would like to host a podcast and have that be, you know, additional touch point in a way to build relationships much, much like you were expressing that you enjoy about it, right?

Yeah, absolutely. I think something I really like about the way you've described things and I haven't heard it put quite like this before. It's a really nice framework that you have there. One of the things I love about it is everybody who knows about content marketing. So people like Gary Vaynerchuk or Chris Tucker, they regularly talk about it. You have a media company mindset. Gary Vaynerchuk says you need to be 80 percent whatever you do for money and 20 percent media company.

And a lot of people instinctively think, well, that needs to be all me. And another set of people think, well, I just want to I just want to delegate all of that. And neither of those really worked very well, because if you're doing it all yourself, you very quickly burn out. You become repetitive or you don't really get the reach and you don't grow as a business because it's time consuming. And if you accept I've got a.

This all myself, all the time, as you suggested, your creativity can't grow into other more high value areas, but if you try and delegate at all, it loses all personality, it loses all integrity. And what I love about your way of doing things is it allows people to keep this foundational level of visibility. That's really tactical. It's entirely congruent with that business owner. It allows them to add their own personal layer. But it's also very tactical.

And I love that. We thank you. So what does your business actually look like? Who who are your clients and how do they discover you?

Yeah, so our clients are, as I mentioned earlier, they're mostly coaches. They're in the coaching space. That could be health coaches, wealth coaches, relationship coaches, many coaches. And if they're not coaches, they tend to have coaching or mentoring types of elements to their business. So they might have courses or a mastermind. I'm an example, you know, one of our clients that we worked with and for a good year or so now, she is a speech language pathologist and Miyo functional therapist.

And she. Yeah, yeah. And I may have said that wrong. So, Holly, if you're listening, my apologies. Exactly. Exactly. Needless to say, she's in the medical therapy sort of space. And what she does is she actually has a course, a membership and a mastermind community for other professionals in her same field who either want to deepen their skills in a particular area or have networking and continuing education opportunities. And then she has the mastering for the folks who want to actually have their want to move from working for someone else's practice and to moving there.

So there's a coaching sort of feel to it, even though she's not, you know, kind of the traditional coaching model. So that's that's primarily who we work with. I've been asked before kind of nurture matrix work for another business or another type of business. I would say definitely for other service based businesses, because when we're looking at our particular way of looking at and defining or messaging is really around perspective shifting where we're very well tuned to developing messaging that help people shift their mindset so that they can take the action.

Right. Usually the reason someone hasn't solved a problem when it's something when it's like an internal problem or, you know, a transformation type problem, it's usually their mindset is the biggest competition. Right. They're not it's not necessarily that they are trying to decide which coach to hire. It's usually that they know which coach they should probably hire. And they're kind of battling their their inner inner game a little bit and kind of psyching themselves out and not taking that next step.

So that's pretty common in the coaching world. And so the framework was really developed for that type of client. But other service based businesses, I think, again, could benefit because there are similar elements of kind of selling the intangible right.

When you're when you're in a service capacity. Could it work for a product business? I'm not sure that it maybe.

I think the the core framework I think certainly the idea of, again, communicating kind of core messaging, I don't know if our particular way of doing it work. We haven't played with a lot of products to do that. I love to I really have a soft spot myself for for kind of coaching and education and just sort of, you know, self transformational, self transformation, personal development, all that good stuff. So that's my little selfish way of being able to learn with every client, every client that we work, we work with.

We get kind of like a master class. And even though I don't know the ins and outs of my functional therapy, there have been some things where I'm like, hey, you know, I like sharing some of the knowledge and you should check this person out because X, Y, Z, I get all of these really cool tidbits and factoids that I get to share. So that's how we work with and they typically find us. It's really interesting for the first two years and the agency is about two and a half years old now.

And until I would say June. Yeah, June. That was when we hired our first full time content marketing specialist. We were like, you know, the content marketing agency or nurture marketing agency that really didn't do any outward marketing.

You know, this is because we work exclusively with coaches and because, as you've so generously complimented me on, the framework is is quite a different way of looking at things. So what typically would happen is, you know, it's kind of like we had our first couple of clients who were close contacts of mine and then referral referral referral, which to me is always the highest compliment, you know, for any work that we can do.

It absolutely is. I mean, one of the things that I found intriguing with you, for somebody that does what you do, you have a very small online footprint. Really? Yeah. And this will usually tell me one of two things. You're either really good at what you do or you're really part of what you do. That's a really great way of looking at it to. You're totally right. Thankfully, it's the former and not the luck.

Well, I know who you know and I know who you're working for. And so it is it is the latter. Former latter.

Good luck. Thank you.

And I think what's really nice about what you bring to the mix is a lot of people, especially in the online space, they always try and shout from the top of the funnel to the bottom saying, hey, buy my thing. It doesn't really work very well. And a lot of people, especially if they're new to digital marketing, this is how they'll approach things like Facebook ads, is they just try and use ads to sell things rather than use ads to reach and brand awareness.

And what I love about your business is it takes the whole buyer's journey into account. There's an impulse, there's a need. And that impulse that need becomes conscious for a moment. And you think I think I maybe need to take some action of some kind on this impulse and maybe I want to buy a pair of shoes. Maybe I want to hire a submarine, maybe I want to hire a coach. There's a buying journey for everybody. And that's what nurture is for.

Nurture is for capturing somebody's attention when they've had that impulse and nurturing that impulse over time so that when somebody is ready to buy, they fall in your direction rather than someone else's. You're the guy they know, you're the person they've fallen in love with. And nurture is really, really important. And yet you can apply it in every business. But what I like about yours is you've decided I'm going to focus on the people who I love serving.

These are my people and not simply going out looking for anybody that's in business and saying, hey, you need to look at nurturing this really cool. So well done for that. It's you must be very tempting to sort of. Look all around for companies with money and say, and wave your hand like everyone else, but it doesn't you don't need to. That's what I love. Thank you.

Yeah, it is. You know, it is pretty tempting. I've had folks as you kind of grow the agency and think about scaling and everything else. I have had a couple of colleagues and this would really work for the industry. And I just sort of like.

Yes, and maybe one day, you know, this agency may grow beyond me and maybe I'll have another CEO and they can make that decision.

But but for now, being the CEO, I'm like, this is this is the one place that I get to be self-serving. I absolutely am in love with the coaching industry. There are certainly, as with every industry, there are some some shadow sides to it and some, you know, some things that you're kind of like, you know, is this the way we want to operate? But I love being able to elevate and amplify the voices of online leaders who I believe in and care about and know that they legitimately do incredible work.


So for anyone who is thinking, hey, yeah, let me let me check Marysia creative out on social media, please also follow any of the clients that we feature. And we do feature them regularly because they are incredible coaches as well.

And they are a lot of them really are, because I know some of them and I'm curious to know you come across as very competent and skilled and you clearly know where you're going. But in any business owner, that's only half the picture. Where do you find you actually struggle the most?

You know, and this is like that. It always feels like the the the that job interview question where they they are like, how can you tell me your weaknesses or whatever I am forever the recovering perfectionist. So the place that I struggle the most truly is in ingrowing team and and delegating. So I was sharing that. I hired my first full time person.

And so she is experiencing sort of the evolved version of of my leadership. And I'm sure she is very grateful for that. And I'm you know, we're building the business together in a way that I'm able to leverage her brilliance and also build that trust where I'm like, yep, you've got this. It's all good. But yeah, the hardest part is, like not, you know, is, I guess kind of limiting the agency's growth because I do care so deeply about sort of every single email that is created through a matrix and every social post that goes out.

And so you can imagine that if your brain and your heart is holding all of that for for clients, that also limits limits the growth. So I think if I was a different type of leader, maybe a less of a perfectionist in practice, you know, maybe he would have a much bigger social media following and maybe we'd have like double or triple whatever the clients. But at this point, I am happy to be the boutique agency that's growing.

And, you know, we're we're working on some things to change and tighten up the way that we deliver certain things so that I can I can I can be better supported. But I love to hold on to to all of the little details and make sure they're absolutely perfect, which, you know, we both know doesn't exist. So that can be a fun game in itself. But yeah, that would be my that's like my downsizer downside. That's my little Achilles heel.

Yeah. Perfectionism as a moving target you will never, ever hit. I guess something else I'm curious to ask. This question may go somewhere, but so if it was, I'll take the question afterwards. But I'm curious to know you seem your business rather seems like it's quite linear. You sell a service. Are there any other revenue streams alongside that or are you planning any other revenue streams?

Yeah, great question. And I think it'll I think it'll go just fine. I thank you for asking. So we do the nurture matrix as a project and it's, you know, that's kind of our our bread and butter or our front door offer, if you will. And then we do have clients who, after the experience of having worked with myself in the team and having I think, you know, the other byproduct besides kind of walking away with having this evergreen nurture sequence and knowing how to roll it out and everything else.

One of the things that my clients really love most from that initial experience is having a another brain, you know, a marketing brain that they really connect with who is able to pull out clearer messaging and help them to really elevate the way that they've been communicating with their audience. And so, you know, after or even usually it's the clients who who step into the next way that we serve. They're usually asking after, like the first month, they're like, hey, so can we stay together forever?

How can. I would love to I would love to talk messaging in other areas of my funnel or, you know, I'd love to talk messaging about my upcoming launch or enrollment campaign or whatever. And so the other revenue stream that we have is an ongoing retainer. It's my marketing director OnDemand program, and it's kind of like what it sounds like. A lot of coaches, they you know, this isn't true for everybody. But what I tend to see is that as they're growing and they start delegating out content creation and marketing, they often end up in a place where they have, you know, maybe a maybe a project manager and maybe a business manager and then a bunch of marketing related contractors.

So maybe a copywriter and a graphic designer, all of those things. But they're usually missing a marketing director. Right. And so what I mean by that, like the business manager's off mostly handling operations and, you know, sometimes will come in and kind of chime in, but otherwise it ends up being the client, the coach communicating big vision, marketing things to a project manager when a project managers skill set is best used in kind of breaking down the task.

But they aren't necessarily the ones that can go from from big visionary conversation to having overall creative direction. And then and then just all the steps of what to do. Right, the steps of what to do, they can handle. But that kind of translating the vision into some creative direction that the entire marketing team can act on is not that's usually the gap that's missing. And so the coach will end up wearing that hat and something always gets lost in translation or they feel stifled because they're kind of telling the team what to do all the time rather than collaborating and coming up with things that are even better.

Right. So once they have that experience or a version of that experience with me, as we create their nurture messaging, they are sort of like, how else can we implement this? And so we'll step in and we'll support them. You know, it's kind of like an ongoing retainer. We've got clients who have been in that recurring sort of program or retainer for a year and a half, almost like since we started, basically. Yeah, yeah.

I mean, that retainer space makes a lot of sense for you because successful people will want more of whatever it was that made them successful. So, yeah, that makes perfect sense.

So we do that and then at some point, you know, kind of been playing with different ways, you know, Disneynature. Matrix framework, you know, it could easily become a chorus or something like that. So I thought about that sometimes. And, you know, kind of what that would look like. And I've also had that sort of thought in my head around potentially certifying like social media managers or other folks on on using the same process as well.

So who knows if that'll get growth, but that's been tossed around a couple of times as well.

And you haven't been tempted working with coaches so much to think. There's probably a coaching business there.

You know, I've I've thought of it, but I know that I am not a coach. I'm very much like the consultant strategist. And I'm like, you need to do it like this.

Whereas coaching is very much like help the person arrive at their own conclusions. And, you know, they're you know, they need to kind of make their own decisions. And I'm straight up. I'm like, no, no, it needs to be you know, we can talk about it for a little while. But I can tell you right now, it needs to be X, Y and Z.

Well, I'm going to offer a different perspective on this, because what you described as somebody who helps them arrive at their own decisions, for me, that's a mentor where as a coach knows how to do it, knows how it should be done, can be done systematically and predictably and says you need to do this. So when I'm hiring a coach, I'm looking for a coach that's going to say you need to do this and it's going to help me understand why and then hold me accountable to that.

If you hire a tennis coach, why are you hiring a tennis coach?

True. That is a great perspective. Thank you.

So I think coaches come in different flavors and they're not all about sort of gently leading you. Sometimes it's the kick up the ass that's needed.

Yeah, you know, that's a really great perspective. And it also speaks to that kind of the coaching industry. There are so many different Pierpoint flavors of of coaches, which is why it's a lot of fun to play in that space. So maybe I'll yeah, maybe I'll revisit that.

I'm just putting out. OK, thank you.

I love your business. I think nurturing is something people rarely think about unless they're quite well embedded in the business. But even then, it's often something that we really isolate down to thinking about email marketing. But looking at it from a much broader perspective, it's so useful. I guess what I would like to know is obviously everything comes back to vision. At the end of the day, when you started this business, you started it because of whyever you started it.

But your vision probably isn't the same. No, I'm not. Curious to know, where does Timika want to see her business going in four years, five years Wooters? Who did you want to become? And what is your personal brand journey look like? Because doing what you're doing is quite unique. But everybody wants things to grow everything. Everybody wants things to be bigger. What's what does your dream look like?

Yeah, that's a really great question. I've been doing some very interesting kind of vision, visioning work and stuff like that, as we mentioned, and kind of retooling the way that we deliver some things. And so vision, the vision and kind of values and all that piece have been a part of it. I think ultimately in you're right, the vision when I started this agency, actually when I started this agency, I don't even know that there was a vision because because I was just sort of like I never imagined having an agency at all.

That was it was not a thing that I thought I would do. Why did you do it?

Yeah, I was working. I was actually I was content marketing manager for a very successful coach, seven figure kind of coaching business, really well known. And I was, you know, working in kind of a contractor role. And so contractors, often there's a cap on on income. So you because everyone's got a marketing budget, there's a budget. Right. So I was looking at the numbers and sort of thinking, I can't work forever for this one client.

What else? And I and I don't want to just kind of replicate this and do the same thing for other folks because I can see where my time will either get destroyed. I'll have no and I've got a couple of kids. I'm like, I'll either have no time for anything else but a handful of clients. So I started to think about, like, what could I do? That's that's bigger than me. And I think when I started, I was like, you know, the income piece and then also sustainable, like, what can I do that's sustainable?

And then the other piece of it was that I noticed in her business, that gap that I mentioned earlier, we were in that place where it was even though I was content marketing manager, I didn't start that way. I kind of grew into that when I started. I was kind of a content content creator or something like that. And I identified this place of kind of, you know, we've we don't really we've got a business manager and I'm supposed to be creating the content, but I spend a heck of a lot of time on messaging and big vision and kind of where that whole communication arc is going to go.

So that was an opportunity for me to really own my skills. You know, I came from corporate marketing, but like, you know, ten years prior. And so I had been laid off before I started in and running my own business in 2010. So anyway, I sort of saw what was going on for that particular client. And I was just I could see the opportunity to really help and support her and support myself. So I'm a very I'm very much about the win win win.

So when I started the agency, it was really the vision was I'm going to run this thing. It's going to be a win win win for everybody, myself included. A way we go, what it turns into, who knows. Right. But it's just, you know, looking for that ultimate win win win. I think now that I've been at it for a couple of years coming into year three, the vision really is to I mean, number one, we we still are limiting ourselves with the number of coaches that we can support.

And yet the coaching industry is growing day by day. I think the most recent statistics, like a fifty million dollar industry, there are several hundred thousand coaches just in North America alone. So I really I do believe there may be some that are coming from the wrong intention and aren't that skilled and, you know, putting shingles out in front of their door one day and just deciding they're a coach with kind of no background. And there are a ton of very brilliant leaders who have the capacity to help so many people self actualize, use their creativity, create their own businesses.

Like I'm a stand for, you know, using all your gifts and and monetizing them where it makes sense to do so. Like, kind of I'm sort of down with the traditional workforce, if you will. You know, it's great for some folks and we can kind of see in a year like this how fragile that really is. So I am a stand for having, you know, the messages and the mentorship that's needed to support people as we kind of, you know, change change the way that people work and live, having those messages go out to bigger and bigger audiences.

So, you know, the real vision, Bob, is to see the agency grow to a place where we can be serving and supporting. You know, right now we we maybe serve a few dozen coaches in a year. I would love to be in the place where we're serving and supporting a few thousand coaches in a year because we know the industry is big enough. And I believe that there are that many coaches and mentors who are who are needed and who are valuable.

So, you know, it's growth for sure over the next four years. And also a you know, from a personal perspective, the goal is really it's growth, but with me really stepping into stepping away. For me, the perfectionist leadership and into the role as a visionary leader in my own business, and this is the place where I'm not always a super fan of all of these methodologies, but this is the place where I do see my agency going.

Today, we are supporting others in streamlining content and and messaging and helping them to connect with their audiences in a much deeper way and so that they can build programs and all those things in an effortless way.

And I do think in the next chapter there may be a version of a media company like Urrutia creative, not just helping coaches and mentors to do this within their business, but also having platforms to be able to do some of that amplification and the elevation of their messages ourselves, you know, just to step up and support that way.

So, you know, that's quite an exciting vision. I really like that. Thank you. So to me, if people want to connect with you, how would you like them to do that?

Yeah, we are on social and that's a really great place to connect. As you mentioned, we're growing our social. We would love to connect with more folks there so you can follow us at Urrutia Creative on Instagram and Twitter and Facebook as well, out of reach of creative satphone, ladies to stay in touch.

And if anyone is sort of curious about the nurture matrix and how to start looking at their own nurture content in a much more strategic way, we just created a amazing well, actually, we didn't just create it. It's been it's existed in our business for quite some time. It's it's the sort of step zero for a lot of our clients in their journeys with us. But it's a nurture opportunity scorecard. So what it is, is a an assessment that you can and it comes with the video to help you figure out what all these different buckets mean.

But it's the assessment we use to be able to show our clients sort of what the gaps and opportunities are within their existing neuromarketing. And it just sort of serves as a basis for our work with them. But you can get a copy of that yourself. If you go to nurture Matrix Dotcom scorecard and you can download it, there's a video and it'll help you to look at both, you know, sort of the composition of your nurture marketing as well as the messaging that's that's rolling out as well.

So you can start to look at things just a little bit more strategic. So, again, that's nurture matrix dotcom scorecard.

And I'll put a link to that in the show. Notes to me, because you've been an awesome guest. It's been great fun and I've learned tons. So I'm really grateful for that. I should bring things to an end with the question that I remember now. I don't think I've forgotten this question for a long time. What's one thing you do now that you wish you'd started five years ago?

Now, that's a really great question. And guess what it is? Email list building and maintenance. You know, we don't we don't have a terribly large email list. And, you know, it's interesting because you could sort of argue, well, you know, your business five years ago didn't exist. And so, you know, what would be the point?

And the point for me would really be I am amazing at building relationships, meeting new people and have had various journeys, various lives as an entrepreneur. But I wish that there was a through line and I wish that I had created a list, cultivated a list and kind of maintained relationships through email marketing, because that's always for our own business. And I and it's why when I step in and I'm working with clients and they say to us, even super successful folks, yeah, we haven't really been up and up on the email, but email marketing is so valuable, even if you're changing directions, you know, having an email list that I just kept in touch with regularly from a personal perspective, even if it wasn't from a business perspective, I could see how that could be super duper valuable right now.

So I wish that, you know, I that was the one place that I practice what I preach. And I have made peace with the fact that for a while I've sort of run the agency, kind of like the cobbler whose kids have no shoes. Right.

So we're changing all of that now. But if I could go back five years, I would do just that.

But I think for anybody listening, anybody that's been listening for a long time will start to see a pattern in the answers that people give. And your answer is one of the most common people need to learn from that and think, OK, everybody's saying list building.

So anybody listening list building start today to me because you've been an awesome guest.

I'm really grateful for your time. It's been lovely to meet you. Thank you very much. Thanks so much, Bob.

I had a wonderful time chatting with you too. If you approach to social media is like a cat with its arse on fire, then maybe taking a little of Tameka's approach could really help take the pressure off. I'll be reviewing my own approach. Based on this and hopefully freeing up some time to focus on what it's all about, relationships, not content, before we go, just a quick reminder to subscribe. And if you haven't already joined my Facebook group, you'll find a link in the show, notes or visit, amplify me dot com forward slash insiders.

I would love for you to connect with me on social media. You'll find me wherever you hang out to search for at Bob Gentle. And if you do connect, let me know. That way I can follow you back. If you enjoyed the show. Take a second right now and I mean right now to leave all of you on iTunes. It would mean so much to me and it's the best way to help me reach more subscribers. My name is Bob Gentil.

Thanks again to Tamika for giving us her time this week and most importantly to you for listening. And I will see you next week.